Baltimore Bridge collapse

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tamada
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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by tamada » March 27, 2024, 9:21 pm

Nobody here is investigating. We can only speculate.

Further information indicates that the emergency power generator didn't restore power to the vessel's disabled propulsion systems. Disabled propulsion means a dead rudder, and a dead rudder means no steering. Dropping the anchors was the next best option, but at over 110,000 t and already doing 8 knots, that ship's not going to stop on a dime. Full astern, even if they had somehow restored propulsion systems, would not be an option as all vestiges of steering and control are lost when switching to full-astern. Doing that on a moving ship and it could easily end up 'arse about face' as maaka suggests. You can do full-astern in open seas (Hollywood and Star Trek), but not anywhere congested.


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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by Doodoo » March 27, 2024, 9:40 pm

"Nobody here is investigating. We can only speculate."

Who are you talking for this time?

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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by Bubbler » March 28, 2024, 3:17 am

Makes you wonder about the safety standards and all. My thoughts are with those affected by this mess.

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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by Khun Paul » March 28, 2024, 6:48 am

Anybody here tried to stop a car rolling down a road , freely, well multiply that by1000Plus, once a ship is undereway just dropping an anchor would have an affect maybe after two to three miles if your lucky .
So berfore some start pontificating about how to stop a fully laden ship, consider this a supertanker underway at 10 knots will take over 10 to 15 miles to stop with no power .
I suspect the Captain tried everything but was unable to do a damn thing, sort of like a slow motion film .

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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by tamada » March 28, 2024, 8:15 am

The NTSB says it could take up to two years to complete their investigation.
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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by tamada » March 28, 2024, 8:20 am

Doodoo wrote:
March 27, 2024, 9:40 pm
"Nobody here is investigating. We can only speculate."

Who are you talking for this time?
Sorry for your loss.
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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by Bandung_Dero » March 28, 2024, 9:54 am

Khun Paul wrote:
March 28, 2024, 6:48 am
I suspect the Captain tried everything but was unable to do a damn thing, sort of like a slow motion film .
And I believe there was at least one harbor pilot on board.

Further to my post above re pylon engineering:-
The bridge rests on four supports, two of which sit each side of the navigable waterway. It is these two piers that are critical to protect against ship impacts.

And indeed, there were two layers of protection: a so-called "dolphin" structure made from concrete, and a fender. The dolphins are in the water about 100 metres upstream and downstream of the piers. They are intended to be sacrificed in the event of a wayward ship, absorbing its energy and being deformed in the process but keeping the ship from hitting the bridge itself.
Full explanation here, does refer to the fact the current protective measures were not up to ships of this size.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-03-28/ ... /103643460
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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by Whistler » March 28, 2024, 10:16 am

Inevitable that the nutters have come up with this, seems the event was orchastrated to stop Trump winning the election in November, as the election will certainly be called off now this Black Swan Event has taken place. OMG, the Deep State and Biden are part of an evil cabal.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 ... y-theories
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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by Doodoo » March 28, 2024, 1:02 pm

"These incidents, and the toll – with at least five killed in China, and six still missing in Baltimore – have highlighted what experts say is the urgent need to improve or protect old bridges to accommodate larger modern vessels." https://ca.yahoo.com/news/three-ships-h ... 03221.html
Maybe they could put the combined work effort also in stopping/reducing motorcycles accidents worldwide

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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by semperfiguy » March 29, 2024, 9:41 am

Colossians 2:8-10...See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, which are based on human tradition and the spiritual forces of the world rather than on Christ. For in HIM dwells all the fullness of the GODHEAD bodily; and you are complete in HIM, who is the head of all principality and power.

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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by jackspratt » March 29, 2024, 10:01 am

Random nutter on Facebook ....... lol.

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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by Whistler » March 29, 2024, 10:21 am

jackspratt wrote:
March 29, 2024, 10:01 am
Random nutter on Facebook ....... lol.
And other sites like forums. 🙄
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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by Udon Map » March 29, 2024, 10:39 am

Whistler wrote:
March 28, 2024, 10:16 am
Inevitable that the nutters have come up with this, seems the event was orchastrated to stop Trump winning the election in November, as the election will certainly be called off now this Black Swan Event has taken place.
No doubt. You may recall that near the end of his term, Trump inquired about the possibility of suspending the Constitution when it looked as if he might lose to Biden.

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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by semperfiguy » March 30, 2024, 1:05 pm

See, I told you it was Biden's fault!
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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by Whistler » March 30, 2024, 1:10 pm

If I had 50 baht for every time I have seen this Right Wing meme in the past week, I could ring the bell in the busiest bars in soi Sampan
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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by Laan Yaa Mo » March 30, 2024, 1:27 pm

Whistler wrote:
March 30, 2024, 1:10 pm
If I had 50 baht for every time I have seen this Right Wing meme in the past week, I could ring the bell in the busiest bars in soi Sampan
Someone must spend a lot of time in Soi Sampan reading right wing rags 555+. It's the first time I've seen this silly cartoon, and I have yet to venture to Soi Sampan in the months I have spent in Udon. Tawan Daeng, yes, I have experienced the night life there.
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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by Whistler » March 30, 2024, 1:55 pm

Laan Yaa Mo wrote:
March 30, 2024, 1:27 pm
Whistler wrote:
March 30, 2024, 1:10 pm
If I had 50 baht for every time I have seen this Right Wing meme in the past week, I could ring the bell in the busiest bars in soi Sampan
Someone must spend a lot of time in Soi Sampan reading right wing rags 555+. It's the first time I've seen this silly cartoon, and I have yet to venture to Soi Sampan in the months I have spent in Udon. Tawan Daeng, yes, I have experienced the night life there.
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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by sometimewoodworker » March 31, 2024, 7:37 pm

Bandung_Dero wrote:
March 28, 2024, 9:54 am
Khun Paul wrote:
March 28, 2024, 6:48 am
I suspect the Captain tried everything but was unable to do a damn thing, sort of like a slow motion film .
And I believe there was at least one harbor pilot on board.

Further to my post above re pylon engineering:-
The bridge rests on four supports, two of which sit each side of the navigable waterway. It is these two piers that are critical to protect against ship impacts.

And indeed, there were two layers of protection: a so-called "dolphin" structure made from concrete, and a fender. The dolphins are in the water about 100 metres upstream and downstream of the piers. They are intended to be sacrificed in the event of a wayward ship, absorbing its energy and being deformed in the process but keeping the ship from hitting the bridge itself.
Full explanation here, does refer to the fact the current protective measures were not up to ships of this size.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-03-28/ ... /103643460
If you look at the satellite photo it is clear that the dolphins that should have been in place and are claimed to have protected the bridge are much too far from the bridge piers, far too small and 150 meters coming from the port (not 100 meters) in front of the support [the ship is three hundred metres, so it’s easy to judge the distance], this allowed the MV Dali to totally avoid the protection as it angled into the bridge pier coming into the port it’s likely that they are 100 meters in front
IMG_8633.jpeg
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-03-28/baltimore-bridge-collapse-engineer-explains-why-what-to-change/103643460?utm_campaign=abc_news_web&utm_content=link&utm_medium=content_shared&utm_source=abc_news_web
An example of a better placement is the Betsy Ross bridge. Would they have been enough? Probably not but they may have stopped to immediate instantaneous collapse and the direct impact on the bridge support
IMG_8634.jpeg
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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by tamada » April 2, 2024, 11:17 am

There's more extensive protection around the utility pylon footings further north of the bridge. Those smaller "baby" dolphin structures were probably deemed adequate for the average gross tonnage of the day 50 years ago.
Screenshot_20240402-111137~2.png
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Re: Baltimore Bridge collapse

Post by sometimewoodworker » April 2, 2024, 1:48 pm

tamada wrote:
April 2, 2024, 11:17 am
There's more extensive protection around the utility pylon footings further north of the bridge. Those smaller "baby" dolphin structures were probably deemed adequate for the average gross tonnage of the day 50 years ago
It is rather unlikely that they are anything but channel markers given the significant distance from the pylons

For another example of protection dolphins
IMG_8757.jpeg
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