ClimateGate busts things wide open

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » May 7, 2018, 4:21 pm

Found some interesting information that shocked me.

Michael Hall, a psychologist from the University of Michigan, led a team of researchers in a yearlong longitudinal study of 600 Americans who “regularly reported their climate change beliefs, pro-environmental behavior, and other climate-change related measures” and published the results of their study in The Journal of Environmental Psychology.

The study revealed that Americans who are skeptical about climate change engage in personal behavior that is more friendly to the environment than climate alarmists, who support increased government regulation.

The results of the study contradict assumptions that people most concerned about climate change would be the most likely to engage in eco-friendly behavior. Instead, there is an inverse correlation between climate-change concern and environmentally beneficial action.

While very supportive of government action on climate, the group of “highly concerned” were the least likely to behave in environmentally friendly ways on a personal level. The self-described “skeptics,” on the other hand, while the most opposed to government climate policies, were also the “most likely to report engaging in individual-level pro-environmental behaviors." The environmental lifestyle choices examined by Hall and his team included recycling, using public transportation, buying “green” products, and using reusable shopping bags.

As a result of the study, researchers concluded that “belief in climate change does not appear to be a necessary or sufficient condition for pro-environmental behavior.”

As Stefan Hartmann of the University of Passau describes in his paper titled “Moral Licensing in the context of Environmental Behaviour,” such an apparent disconnect between belief and action is not uncommon. Supporting government intervention often leads a person to believe he has done his or her share for the environment, leading to “self-licensing” to act in contrary ways at the personal level, as other reports have noted.

Such “moral licensing” may help explain the apparent disconnect between belief and action of the world’s most famous climate alarmist, Al Gore. His 20-room, 10,070-square-foot, Colonial-style mansion reportedly consumes 21.3 times more kilowatt hours than the average U.S. household — including 66,159 kWh per year just to heat his swimming pool.

As reported by the New York Times in 2008, liberals favor generous government spending to help the neediest people at home and abroad, but give comparatively little in personal contributions to charitable causes. Personal virtue can be viewed as less important that government programs, which helps explain why liberals favor higher levels of taxation than conservatives, who would rather donate their money than have it taken from them.

Average annual charitable contributions from households headed by conservatives, for instance, give 30-50 percent more than liberal households, the Times article stated.

Similarly, the “generosity index” from the Catalogue for Philanthropy has found that red states are the most likely to give to nonprofits, while Northeastern states are least likely to do so, it noted.

“How America Gives,” a 2014 study published by The Chronicle of Philanthropy, used IRS data to analyze giving patterns across the country and compared levels of giving with how each state voted in the 2012 presidential election (Romney v. Obama).

The study found that the states in which people gave the highest percentage of their adjusted gross incomes were also states that voted for Romney, while states in which people gave the lowest percentage of their adjusted gross income voted for Obama. The top 17 most generous states all went for Romney.

The partisan divide in generosity is not limited to charitable donations. Conservatives also appear to be significantly more generous than liberals in nonfinancial ways, such as volunteering their time and giving blood, the Times article said.

Very interesting studies all around.
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » May 10, 2018, 8:23 am

Earth's orbital changes have influenced climate, life forms for at least 215 million years

May 7, 2018
Columbia University

https://m.phys.org/news/2018-05-ancient ... -deep.html
Scientists drilling deep into ancient rocks in the Arizona desert say they have documented a gradual shift in Earth's orbit that repeats regularly every 405,000 years, playing a role in natural climate swings. Astrophysicists have long hypothesized that the cycle exists based on calculations of celestial mechanics, but the authors of the new research have found the first verifiable physical evidence. They showed that the cycle has been stable for hundreds of millions of years, from before the rise of dinosaurs, and is still active today.

Kent and Olsen say that every 405,000 years, when orbital eccentricity is at its peak, seasonal differences caused by shorter cycles will become more intense; summers are hotter and winters colder; dry times drier, wet times wetter. The opposite will be true 202,500 years later, when the orbit is at its most circular. During the late Triassic, for poorly understood reasons, the Earth was much warmer than it is now through many cycles, and there was little to no glaciation. Then, the 405,000-year cycle showed up in strongly alternating wet and dry periods. Precipitation peaked when the orbit was at its most eccentric, producing deep lakes that left layers of black shale in eastern North America. When the orbit was most circular, things dried up, leaving lighter layers of soil exposed to the air.
Not even a Believer with all their data -- forged or otherwise -- can control the planetary cycle that helps to determine climate.
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by papafarang » May 10, 2018, 9:15 am

Lone Star wrote:
May 10, 2018, 8:23 am
Earth's orbital changes have influenced climate, life forms for at least 215 million years

May 7, 2018
Columbia University

https://m.phys.org/news/2018-05-ancient ... -deep.html
Scientists drilling deep into ancient rocks in the Arizona desert say they have documented a gradual shift in Earth's orbit that repeats regularly every 405,000 years, playing a role in natural climate swings. Astrophysicists have long hypothesized that the cycle exists based on calculations of celestial mechanics, but the authors of the new research have found the first verifiable physical evidence. They showed that the cycle has been stable for hundreds of millions of years, from before the rise of dinosaurs, and is still active today.

Kent and Olsen say that every 405,000 years, when orbital eccentricity is at its peak, seasonal differences caused by shorter cycles will become more intense; summers are hotter and winters colder; dry times drier, wet times wetter. The opposite will be true 202,500 years later, when the orbit is at its most circular. During the late Triassic, for poorly understood reasons, the Earth was much warmer than it is now through many cycles, and there was little to no glaciation. Then, the 405,000-year cycle showed up in strongly alternating wet and dry periods. Precipitation peaked when the orbit was at its most eccentric, producing deep lakes that left layers of black shale in eastern North America. When the orbit was most circular, things dried up, leaving lighter layers of soil exposed to the air.
Not even a Believer with all their data -- forged or otherwise -- can control the planetary cycle that helps to determine climate.
and the point is ? what point are we at now, and what does this piece of useless info have on the sudden climate change ? do they have daily records of the weather from 202,250 years back so they can compare them with the last 250 years ? talk about being a bot, just copy and paste worthless known info that has absolutely nothing to do with pollution by man. they told us about the ozone depleting , I believed them , then they acted to ban cfc's, took time but now it's returning. or do you think it was government just trying to tax us unfairly by making us pay more for a fridge ? and there ozone ,proof man can change the climate for the better or worse
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » May 13, 2018, 11:21 pm

Well, it looks like it really is all about MONEY.

An international climate change conference in Germany that was attended by over 200 countries, has ended without any agreement on the major issues of finance and transparency.

Climate change finance has been in trouble from the beginning. The 2015 climate change conference that produced the famous “Paris Climate Change Accord” dictated that the “rich countries” of the world would provide $100 billion per year to the “developing countries,” starting in 2020.

However, since Trump has pulled the U.S. out of the Paris agreement, other “rich countries” now have to find a way to fill the gap that was created.

Apparently, the countries that criticize the US for leaving the Paris accord don't have much success in reducing their carbon emissions, which have even increased in some instances over the last 3 years.

In 2007, there was a UNCC conference held in Bali. Over 150 countries sent reps. The rich countries would have to contribute $100 billion to a fund for developing countries. The United Nations would control this money and administer the fund. And what numbskull would trust the UN to do this? 55555

At that time, digging a little deeper, it turned out that Louis Redshaw, Head of Environment Markets, Barclays Capital, was leading an effort to issue synthetic securities to trade in carbon credits. It was predicted that the carbon-trading market would top $1 trillion within a decade. In the last 11 years since that conference, nothing has changed. Climate change has accomplished nothing except as a financial scam.

When the US left the Paris climate accord, it forced other countries to put up or shut up. The EU globalists took on the role of becoming the leader of the “rich” or developed countries, while China would be the leader of the developing countries.

With China building a new coal plant every week, they still claim to be a "developing country" so they won't have to provide funding under the Paris accord. No, this MMCC Hoax isn't about money. 55555

But it's not just about money. These MMCC conferences are also failing in climate change transparency. Each country is required to open its accounting books to prove that it is meeting its emission reduction commitments. China demands that they not be held accountable and that all "developing countries" do not have to follow these accounting rules and transparency. :) These rules were set to begin in 2020.

So the rich developed countries have to cough up all the MONEY and also be totally transparent in their emissions commitments. While the developing countries just collect money and do whatever they wish regarding emissions.

No, it's not about MONEY. 55555

I'm glad Trump got us out of this scam.
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by noosard » May 14, 2018, 3:25 pm

Prediction are that Jellystone (yellowstone) will erupt with enough fury to cause the possibility of it causing a new ice age
Can see Ice Age 6 Jellystone

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » May 16, 2018, 11:11 am

Catherine McKenna aka/Climate Barbie (that's how some in Canada tag her), the Environmental Minister in Canada appointed by Trudeau, has had a difficult time answering the same questions that I continuously pose to Believers about proposed carbon taxes and their specific methods for slowing, stopping or reducing climate change effects and where/how the money will be spent.

In this 7+ minute video, she can never answer the question as to the cost to Canadians for the carbon tax. Seems like that would be an easy answer.


In this 2+ minute video, she never answers the question regarding measurable results of the environmental action that is proposed.


So here is a government official, bringing her country neck-deep into carbon taxes, but can't or won't provide the information asked. No bash on Canada because other politicians in Canada are asking the right questions -- How much will it cost Canadians? What will be our gains in all of this? I have never found any government official in any country who can provide an answer to the "measurable gains" question, and very few ever want to talk about how much it will cost their citizenry.

As I've said before, it's as if everyone is just supposed to accept big government's word, write a blank check and trust them to improve the environment without ever seeing a specific plan with measurable results.

It's not about money ... 55555 Right . . .
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by pipoz4444 » May 21, 2018, 11:15 am

The opposition member is quite direct and professional in putting forward his questions, but she (Catherine McKenna) is just another dumb Blonde out of her depth, that managed to make her way into Politics. \:D/

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » May 22, 2018, 8:01 am

pipoz4444 wrote:
May 21, 2018, 11:15 am
The opposition member is quite direct and professional in putting forward his questions, but she (Catherine McKenna) is just another dumb Blonde out of her depth, that managed to make her way into Politics. \:D/
Yes, she's in WAY over her head. There isn't anyone anywhere who can answer the questions that are posed, but the others do a better job of tap dancing and obfuscating.
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Giggle » June 5, 2018, 12:31 pm

Interesting story on climate change and how it has run out of enthusiasm.

By Steven F. Hayward
Wall Street Journal
June 4, 2018

Climate change is over. No, I’m not saying the climate will not change in the future, or that human influence on the climate is negligible. I mean simply that climate change is no longer a pre-eminent policy issue. All that remains is boilerplate rhetoric from the political class, frivolous nuisance lawsuits, and bureaucratic mandates on behalf of special-interest renewable-energy rent seekers.

Judged by deeds rather than words, most national governments are backing away from forced-marched decarbonization. You can date the arc of climate change as a policy priority from 1988, when highly publicized congressional hearings first elevated the issue, to 2018. President Trump’s ostentatious withdrawal from the Paris Agreement merely ratified a trend long becoming evident.

A good indicator of why climate change as an issue is over can be found early in the text of the Paris Agreement. The “nonbinding” pact declares that climate action must include concern for “gender equality, empowerment of women, and intergenerational equity” as well as “the importance for some of the concept of ‘climate justice.’ ” Another is Sarah Myhre’s address at the most recent meeting of the American Geophysical Union, in which she proclaimed that climate change cannot fully be addressed without also grappling with the misogyny and social injustice that have perpetuated the problem for decades.

The descent of climate change into the abyss of social-justice identity politics represents the last gasp of a cause that has lost its vitality. Climate alarm is like a car alarm—a blaring noise people are tuning out.

This outcome was predictable. Political scientist Anthony Downs described the downward trajectory of many political movements in an article for the Public Interest, “Up and Down With Ecology: The ‘Issue-Attention Cycle,’ ” published in 1972, long before the climate-change campaign began. Observing the movements that had arisen to address issues like crime, poverty and even the U.S.-Soviet space race, Mr. Downs discerned a five-stage cycle through which political issues pass regularly.

The first stage involves groups of experts and activists calling attention to a public problem, which leads quickly to the second stage, wherein the alarmed media and political class discover the issue. The second stage typically includes a large amount of euphoric enthusiasm—you might call it the “dopamine” stage—as activists conceive the issue in terms of global peril and salvation. This tendency explains the fanaticism with which divinity-school dropouts Al Gore and Jerry Brown have warned of climate change.

Then comes the third stage: the hinge. As Mr. Downs explains, there soon comes “a gradually spreading realization that the cost of ‘solving’ the problem is very high indeed.” That’s where we’ve been since the United Nations’ traveling climate circus committed itself to the fanatical mission of massive near-term reductions in fossil fuel consumption, codified in unrealistic proposals like the Kyoto Protocol. This third stage, Mr. Downs continues, “becomes almost imperceptibly transformed into the fourth stage: a gradual decline in the intensity of public interest in the problem.”

While opinion surveys find that roughly half of Americans regard climate change as a problem, the issue has never achieved high salience among the public, despite the drumbeat of alarm from the climate campaign. Americans have consistently ranked climate change the 19th or 20th of 20 leading issues on the annual Pew Research Center poll, while Gallup’s yearly survey of environmental issues typically ranks climate change far behind air and water pollution.

“In the final stage,” Mr. Downs concludes, “an issue that has been replaced at the center of public concern moves into a prolonged limbo—a twilight realm of lesser attention or spasmodic recurrences of interest.” Mr. Downs predicted correctly that environmental issues would suffer this decline, because solving such issues involves painful trade-offs that committed climate activists would rather not make.

A case in point is climate campaigners’ push for clean energy, whereas they write off nuclear power because it doesn’t fit their green utopian vision. A new study of climate-related philanthropy by Matthew Nisbet found that of the $556.7 million green-leaning foundations spent from 2011-15, “not a single grant supported work on promoting or reducing the cost of nuclear energy.” The major emphasis of green giving was “devoted to mobilizing public opinion and to opposing the fossil fuel industry.”

Scientists who are genuinely worried about the potential for catastrophic climate change ought to be the most outraged at how the left politicized the issue and how the international policy community narrowed the range of acceptable responses. Treating climate change as a planet-scale problem that could be solved only by an international regulatory scheme transformed the issue into a political creed for committed believers. Causes that live by politics, die by politics.

Mr. Hayward is a senior resident scholar at the Institute of Governmental Studies at the University of California, Berkeley.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/climate-ch ... 1528152876

I'm of the opinion climate change as a global issue isn't bringing in the votes like it used to. It has outlived its usefulness. Oh well, off to the next big crisis.

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by jimjay » June 6, 2018, 3:13 am

Thanks Ronan.

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by papafarang » June 6, 2018, 6:43 am

funny how our resident oil protectionists just copy and paste crap, no reasoned thought , just posting other peoples thoughts . political thoughts, which are completely pointless.... carbon tax :lol: I've said before ,why go through all the effort of pretending we need to change , carbon tax alarmists running around like headless chickens saying it's all about money. look if the government wants more money they simply put tariffs on , tariffs are a tax and easily applied. Trump just proved that. so carbon tax alarmists please explain , the american government just persuaded the people to pay more tax and more for products on the simple premise that the Europeans are ripping America off by offering them high quality goods too cheaply :? and some of you think that it's all an elaborate hoax to raise taxes, you don't need elaborate hoaxes . simply say we need to tax goods to save American jobs...done. carbon tax :lol: you need a better excuse than that
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » June 6, 2018, 12:07 pm

Giggle wrote:
June 5, 2018, 12:31 pm
Interesting story on climate change and how it has run out of enthusiasm.

By Steven F. Hayward
Wall Street Journal
June 4, 2018

Climate change is over. No, I’m not saying the climate will not change in the future, or that human influence on the climate is negligible. I mean simply that climate change is no longer a pre-eminent policy issue. All that remains is boilerplate rhetoric from the political class, frivolous nuisance lawsuits, and bureaucratic mandates on behalf of special-interest renewable-energy rent seekers.

. . .
I saw this article and was astounded, but not because of the claims. I was astounded because of the location of the source: Berkely, California -- one of the most left-leaning cities/universities in the US. Steven F. Hayward, senior resident scholar at the Institute of Governmental Studies at the University of California, Berkeley. Wow. Never thought something like this article would ever originate from someplace like that.

The most salient points for me:
The descent of climate change into the abyss of social-justice identity politics represents the last gasp of a cause that has lost its vitality. Climate alarm is like a car alarm—a blaring noise people are tuning out.

. . .
Hayward lays out the five stages of a political movement, with which climate change has tracked perfectly. It's now suffering the inglorious fifth stage:
Stage 1: Experts and activists call attention to a public problem.
Stage 2: The "alarmed media and political class discover the issue" and often stir up "euphoric enthusiasm ... as activists conceive the issue in terms of global peril and salvation."
Stage 3: The "hinge," characterized by "a gradually spreading realization that the cost of ‘solving’ the problem is very high indeed."
Stage 4: The "gradual decline in the intensity of public interest in the problem."
Stage 5: A "prolonged limbo—a twilight realm of lesser attention or spasmodic recurrences of interest," which often involves "painful trade-offs" that activists simply aren't willing to make.

. . .

Treating climate change as a planet-scale problem that could be solved only by an international regulatory scheme transformed the issue into a political creed for committed believers. Causes that live by politics, die by politics.
The five stages of a political movement read like the stages of grief. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: And Hayward even refers to the movement now as an ideology of "believers" giving it a very cult-like characteristic as it progresses through the stages.

And let's not forget the "international regulatory scheme." Yes, it's a scheme. Another way of taking money from citizens, but never providing exactly what the citizen will receive -- specifically -- in return. They can never say how -- specifically -- the revenue will be spent. They can never provide any measurement in order to determine if their unknown "process" for slowing, stopping or reversing the climate issues is working! No one provides specifics. They claim it's just going to happen. At least when a citizen pays taxes on goods purchased, they have the goods in front of them, and they know what they're getting. With climate taxes, the money just disappears down an international rat hole to fund a secret way of slowing, stopping or reversing climate issues.

Yeah, right. I trust governments who throw citizens in jail for speaking truth. :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by rick » June 7, 2018, 8:08 am

Well, renewable energy has taken leaps and bounds in the last couple of years. Sufficient to outstrip any planning. In many countries now too much, so it competes with existing sources. UK now gets up to 27% of electricity from renewable sources compared with a couple of percent 20 years ago. Intermittent supply is the issue, and energy storage is now the problem. No new coal powered plants have been built for 30 years, New nuclear capacity has become so expensive that it cannot compete in an open market, and gas although efficient is vulnerable to fluctuating prices and now has to be imported. Even if it wanted too, the government cannot stop renewable sources from becoming the main source of electricity within about 20 years. Africa will probably skip the fossil fuel phase and go straight to renewables once energy storage is solved (technologies are moving from experimental to proof of concept now). So yes, climate change is dropping out of the headlines.

People more concerned with more iminent problems, like trade wars, real wars and political strife.

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by papafarang » June 7, 2018, 11:27 am

spot on Rick, I was just reading the other day that technology is racing ahead and coupled with new energy efficient products plus a bit of human effort we should easily reach the targets for reducing pollution . by 2040 you won't even be able to buy a petrol/diesel car in the uk. oil now has a limited life now. any economy banking on oil to support their economy are going to be caught out
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Barney » June 7, 2018, 8:05 pm

Rick
New nuclear capacity has become so expensive that it cannot compete in an open market

Nuclear is not yet forgotten.
2.7 GW nuclear plant to kick off construction very soon in Wales. Wylfa Newydd Nuclear Power Plant.
USA is to start building reactors again and the Saudi's are very interested in nuclear power.

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