From your description, rct, they have been a little more careful with Celini.
The quality of construction in FH is sub-standard, the builders being let off without correcting their errors, and the tessabahn refuses to accept any responsibility for operation and maintenance. Since there is no formal mechanism for management of the common areas, maintenance of the parks, streets, street lighting, and security is all paid by purely voluntary contributions.
Housing Projects
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rickfarang
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Re: Housing Projects
RF, sorry to hear about the woes in FHV, and you answered the question, few pay. The same seems typical across Thailand in so many housing estates.
I'm just back from a few weeks in the US visiting many states, always amazed how nice things look there compared to here. The benefit of property taxes and management of adequate resources. No money - no honey.
I'm just back from a few weeks in the US visiting many states, always amazed how nice things look there compared to here. The benefit of property taxes and management of adequate resources. No money - no honey.
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rickfarang
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Re: Housing Projects
Neither is correct.rct wrote:RF, sorry to hear about the woes in FHV, and you answered the question, few pay.
Re: Housing Projects
as i not yet have seen la cellini, like the name sounds must be very expensive indeed, 10-14 mil for a home? waw they probably must have the car port of 300.000 bath, this must be very special homes with special security, ( 3.000/ month), as the americans would say , oh my god...., as i am longtime staying baan noak, without all the security ---- , i have never had any problem, even leaving the home with all windows open...( let 's hope it stay's like this) , anyway as i am curious what a 10-14 mil home looks like , i will have to go see one time....maybe i can find the carport of my dreams....,
for this money in thailand must be very ,very extraordinary......of course for this money normally they must be able to give some service......
for this money in thailand must be very ,very extraordinary......of course for this money normally they must be able to give some service......
Re: Housing Projects
Today Tony (Thanee) one of the family who were/are the developers of La Cellini and FH projects came in CC for a few bits and i questioned him with ref to the points raised on this thread . These were his comments an please dont shoot the messenger .
About FH he didnt just dissapear off the scene but after the completion of the project he atempted to set up a commitee to run the village which basically required at least 50% of the property owners to commit to a set charge for the general day to day running.maintainance etc no one however seemed interested hence nothing was done and he moved on to start La Cellini.
I was fortunate enough to have a good look round Cellini and a very good friend of mine resides there , these 10 - 20 mil homes are like movie sets incredibly luxurious ........ but serious money . I will have to sell a lot more sausages b4 i move in . The 3,000 monthly security etc fee seems fair enough bearing in mind the services / facilities etc , and if you can afford a 20 mil house 3k a month really is like a drop in the ocean .
I am in no way bais and Tony is a nice fella
About FH he didnt just dissapear off the scene but after the completion of the project he atempted to set up a commitee to run the village which basically required at least 50% of the property owners to commit to a set charge for the general day to day running.maintainance etc no one however seemed interested hence nothing was done and he moved on to start La Cellini.
I was fortunate enough to have a good look round Cellini and a very good friend of mine resides there , these 10 - 20 mil homes are like movie sets incredibly luxurious ........ but serious money . I will have to sell a lot more sausages b4 i move in . The 3,000 monthly security etc fee seems fair enough bearing in mind the services / facilities etc , and if you can afford a 20 mil house 3k a month really is like a drop in the ocean .
I am in no way bais and Tony is a nice fella
Re: Housing Projects
26 residences x 3,000 equals 78,000 monthly for security and maintenance of club and pool.
Four guards one gardener and one maintenance tech ought to do it. Settled!
What happens when a third of the units sit empty after two years because the concrete facades are cracking and the sidewalks are cratered and the pretty fountain is mucked up with green sludge? Get the daytime security guard to bring his weed wacker. Have the nighttime security guard skim the pool and wash the clubhouse windows.
What to do when half the units are vacant because the water pressure is so low they can no longer count on regular showers and have to keep their bathtubs full in order to wash dishes? Buy four Rotweillers to replace the security guards and fill the pool with scum sucking river fish and a nice bamboo feature in the corner, next to the burnt-out light.
What to do when Thailand's property tax wave (on residences over 5 million baht -- whoops) hits Udon and the monthly tax exceeds the Rottie's Alpo bill? Each resident hires a full time guard and prays he won't rob them blind when they venture out for a day on the town.
Sounds like the Philippines.
Four guards one gardener and one maintenance tech ought to do it. Settled!
What happens when a third of the units sit empty after two years because the concrete facades are cracking and the sidewalks are cratered and the pretty fountain is mucked up with green sludge? Get the daytime security guard to bring his weed wacker. Have the nighttime security guard skim the pool and wash the clubhouse windows.
What to do when half the units are vacant because the water pressure is so low they can no longer count on regular showers and have to keep their bathtubs full in order to wash dishes? Buy four Rotweillers to replace the security guards and fill the pool with scum sucking river fish and a nice bamboo feature in the corner, next to the burnt-out light.
What to do when Thailand's property tax wave (on residences over 5 million baht -- whoops) hits Udon and the monthly tax exceeds the Rottie's Alpo bill? Each resident hires a full time guard and prays he won't rob them blind when they venture out for a day on the town.
Sounds like the Philippines.
Re: Housing Projects
TP ......... Why so anti everything recently ?? i know being an American is not easy and sometimes you struggle to comunicate on the superior European level but sit down take a deep breath and relax , i can see the signs - nervous tension red blotches on your cheeks ,twitching and after dribbles ,,,,, JUST GET A GRIP AND REALISE THERES NO WAY YOU CAN BECOME BRITISH !! HOWEVER MUCH YOU CRAVE !! SORRY JUST AINT NEVER GONNA HAPPEN .
Re: Housing Projects
Tex does make some good points about the problem of the medium/longer term issues that could well occur.
As he points out, once full & in the immediate term the scheme will undoubtedly run a surplus.
However, anything run by a committee is a horrible beast & no-one can predict which way it will run. But, in my experiences, it will undoubtedly split into factions with different agendas.
What happens after the first break in occurs?? Some will call for more security, some will demand sackings, some will say they are not getting value for money & want out (especially if there is a healthy surplus in the pot).
Will all the members be willing to pay to accumulate a future fund? Maybe some will wish to 'move on' so to pay for others in the future is not in their best interests.
Plus by the time the site needs to commit cash to give it a face lift will undoubtedly be when the individual owners need to do similar. Will people be willing to sacrifice their own property for the good of all? In my experience, never!!
Don't see this as a post suggesting that it cannot work, just that if anyone thinks that it is a few baht a month, no problem, then they are probably in for a very large shock a little down the road!!!
As he points out, once full & in the immediate term the scheme will undoubtedly run a surplus.
However, anything run by a committee is a horrible beast & no-one can predict which way it will run. But, in my experiences, it will undoubtedly split into factions with different agendas.
What happens after the first break in occurs?? Some will call for more security, some will demand sackings, some will say they are not getting value for money & want out (especially if there is a healthy surplus in the pot).
Will all the members be willing to pay to accumulate a future fund? Maybe some will wish to 'move on' so to pay for others in the future is not in their best interests.
Plus by the time the site needs to commit cash to give it a face lift will undoubtedly be when the individual owners need to do similar. Will people be willing to sacrifice their own property for the good of all? In my experience, never!!
Don't see this as a post suggesting that it cannot work, just that if anyone thinks that it is a few baht a month, no problem, then they are probably in for a very large shock a little down the road!!!
Re: Housing Projects
i completely agree with texpat,so my question is , with all this this security and taking care, for this monthly payment, is there any warranty when somethings go wrong?who is responsible , probably thai style again.....guard or no guard.....,
in most of all these chicken farms, as i call them, once they finished the warranty is gone....
in most of all these chicken farms, as i call them, once they finished the warranty is gone....
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Banjo
- udonmap.com
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Re: Housing Projects
WHAT? Texpat doesn't have the dough to buy into the landed gentry? Many ######'s have tried before without successpienmash wrote:TP ......... JUST GET A GRIP AND REALISE THERES NO WAY YOU CAN BECOME BRITISH !! HOWEVER MUCH YOU CRAVE !! SORRY JUST AINT NEVER GONNA HAPPEN .
One would think that the notion of a Body Corporate would be instigated in the Villages with responsibilities and accountabilities attributed to the formed Committee. It appears to be a devoid and erroneous situation at present. Very precarious!
Re: Housing Projects
Planning for the future and community organization is not a forte of Thai developers.
I've lived in many places around the world.
Including both First Home and Lom Yen.
A Thai community house is, by far, the least desirable. As (y)our beloved individual encourages -- self-sufficiency is The Way.
Thai fortunes rise and fall faster than the sun. The nice guy that lives as your community neighbor today, will shove-off back to the village as soon as his short-sighted payments run out. He'll rent to practicing rock band with a three month contract who like practicing on Wednesdays at 2 am. There is no ordinance or community plan forbidding (almost anything) or concept of reasonable order.
Keep your communities. I'm not interested.
How long before the village strongman convinces the long-gone developer to install a loudspeaker for daily announcements and his personal selection of favorite mor-lam songs?
It's like an insurance policy where you pay premiums, but will never, ever collect on a claim. DaFT.
I've lived in many places around the world.
Including both First Home and Lom Yen.
A Thai community house is, by far, the least desirable. As (y)our beloved individual encourages -- self-sufficiency is The Way.
Thai fortunes rise and fall faster than the sun. The nice guy that lives as your community neighbor today, will shove-off back to the village as soon as his short-sighted payments run out. He'll rent to practicing rock band with a three month contract who like practicing on Wednesdays at 2 am. There is no ordinance or community plan forbidding (almost anything) or concept of reasonable order.
Keep your communities. I'm not interested.
How long before the village strongman convinces the long-gone developer to install a loudspeaker for daily announcements and his personal selection of favorite mor-lam songs?
Precisely. Who is responsible? You are. Nobody is held to account but you. So why pay for it?with all this this security and taking care, for this monthly payment, is there any warranty when somethings go wrong?who is responsible
It's like an insurance policy where you pay premiums, but will never, ever collect on a claim. DaFT.
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Laan Yaa Mo
- udonmap.com
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Re: Housing Projects
I would pay for mor-lam blaring all day and all night. I can't get enough of it. It beats the rap that shouts out from the cars, apartments and streets of Toronto.
Re: Housing Projects
Glad someone else (P&M) spoke up for Thanee. He deserves it.
Re: Housing Projects
I've seen La Cellini. Great branding. Lovely interiors. Location S-U-C-K-S (!!!)
For that kind of money, I would not expect to be living in a walled oasis surrounded by the ghetto and across the street from the electric company with views of spaghetti wires whenever I decide to leave the "compound". Really. Imagine any run-down urban area in your hometown. Now build 3 meter high walls around a square block and plop some really nice townhomes inside it. THAT is La Cellini.
It is very well-kept now because the developer wants to sell the remaining units. As others have stated, once all the units are sold and nobody is responsible for the up-keep, the oasis in the middle of the ghetto will become the crime target in the middle of the ghetto.
IMHO, and as rct confirmed in previous posts, buyers are mostly Thais. So, you've got a prestige dynamic where wealthy Thais wanting to flaunt can boast to their friends and associates that they are as good as or better than any wealthy foreigner. They will pay almost any price to gain that sort of "face" or prestige. Location be damned. They are selling to Thailand's equivalent of the "Yuppies" (YUP = Young Urban Professional). Let's call them "Tuppies" as they are trying to transform themselves into HISOs. I saw this happen a lot during the late 80's-90's within my own community in the States. We called those people "Buppies" (Black Urban Professionals). This was the post-Civil Rights, highly educated generation of professionals looking to gain quick social status via conspicuous consumption. The more expensive and away from the traditional community, the better. That era saw row homes that were selling for (literally) $1.00 transformed into vibrant upscale communities where your income had to be above $100k (in the late 80's) just to get a showing appointment.
From a marketing perspective, La Cellini's marketing is brilliant. Bravo! Sincerely.
From a reasonable prospective buyer's perspective (with more money than sense) and looking beyond the now, it would only make sense to live there until the units were all sold, sell yours at a nice appreciated profit, then go somewhere else.
So, if anyone reading this is thinking about buying (perhaps as an investment), BUY NOW not later; and get the hell out when that last unit is being sold.
For that kind of money, I would not expect to be living in a walled oasis surrounded by the ghetto and across the street from the electric company with views of spaghetti wires whenever I decide to leave the "compound". Really. Imagine any run-down urban area in your hometown. Now build 3 meter high walls around a square block and plop some really nice townhomes inside it. THAT is La Cellini.
It is very well-kept now because the developer wants to sell the remaining units. As others have stated, once all the units are sold and nobody is responsible for the up-keep, the oasis in the middle of the ghetto will become the crime target in the middle of the ghetto.
IMHO, and as rct confirmed in previous posts, buyers are mostly Thais. So, you've got a prestige dynamic where wealthy Thais wanting to flaunt can boast to their friends and associates that they are as good as or better than any wealthy foreigner. They will pay almost any price to gain that sort of "face" or prestige. Location be damned. They are selling to Thailand's equivalent of the "Yuppies" (YUP = Young Urban Professional). Let's call them "Tuppies" as they are trying to transform themselves into HISOs. I saw this happen a lot during the late 80's-90's within my own community in the States. We called those people "Buppies" (Black Urban Professionals). This was the post-Civil Rights, highly educated generation of professionals looking to gain quick social status via conspicuous consumption. The more expensive and away from the traditional community, the better. That era saw row homes that were selling for (literally) $1.00 transformed into vibrant upscale communities where your income had to be above $100k (in the late 80's) just to get a showing appointment.
From a marketing perspective, La Cellini's marketing is brilliant. Bravo! Sincerely.
From a reasonable prospective buyer's perspective (with more money than sense) and looking beyond the now, it would only make sense to live there until the units were all sold, sell yours at a nice appreciated profit, then go somewhere else.
So, if anyone reading this is thinking about buying (perhaps as an investment), BUY NOW not later; and get the hell out when that last unit is being sold.
Re: Housing Projects
Khondam, you always keep things fun, and please advise when you are ready to divulge more detail on your secretive project mentioned in your prior post.
The Thai buyers at Le Cellini are wealthy anyway, quite a few "old money" so no need to compare themselves to foreigners, and they are very gracious neighbors. Owners here rather just want to live in a safe convenient location (including close to schools especially high school), in style they can easily afford.
Where dear Khondam, in Udon Thani city, is a housing estate that is safer and more convenient and having nicer surroundings? I'd sincerely like to go have a look if an alternative exists.
The Thai buyers at Le Cellini are wealthy anyway, quite a few "old money" so no need to compare themselves to foreigners, and they are very gracious neighbors. Owners here rather just want to live in a safe convenient location (including close to schools especially high school), in style they can easily afford.
Where dear Khondam, in Udon Thani city, is a housing estate that is safer and more convenient and having nicer surroundings? I'd sincerely like to go have a look if an alternative exists.
Re: Housing Projects
Ha! 
I would be the first to admit that La Cellini is absolutely the best around. No question about that once one enters the "compound". 
Again, I say BRAVO!
When are you guys going to buy up the land across the tracks from UT? Better get it before I do - and don't worry, that is years away for me. I'm so poor right now.
I would be the first to admit that La Cellini is absolutely the best around. No question about that once one enters the "compound". Again, I say BRAVO!When are you guys going to buy up the land across the tracks from UT? Better get it before I do - and don't worry, that is years away for me. I'm so poor right now.
Re: Housing Projects
Pienmash...In reference to your meeting with Thanee at the CC (Whatever that is), he didn't give you the facts about the meeting...All that came about was a bunch of promises to correct the people's complaints...They were too many people there demanding him to take care of their individual problems, that after a while he walked off never to be seen at any meetings since...Shay's husband (2 meetings) and the bookeeper then handle things at a couple of other meetings with the same results...As far as his statement that FHV project was completed and closed out, this is not true...The people tried to organize and incorporate the village so that maintenance of streets, drainage and lighting be maintained by the government and the homeowners committee would collect dues of 200 Baht per month to take care of guards and parks...The developers also had about 12 homes not yet sold and promised to pay the fee of 200 baht per month for these homes, but they stopped payments in 2008 after making only a couple of payments...The close out of this village, to this day, has never taken place since your friend Thanee didn't turn over 5,000,000 to the government to upgrade the village to the proper codes for them to take over the responsibility...By the way I think the escrow account money they had set up also disappeared.
Re: Housing Projects
Nola ...... Whilst Thanee is a friend of mine i am not involved in any way with his business dealings etc , we simply had a chat over a coffee in CC ....... thats my shop Chern Chim in Adunyadhet rd .
Re: Housing Projects
Nice shop...Wish I could say the same for your friend.
Re: Housing Projects
Thank you sir . (ref the shop)NOLA wrote:Nice shop...Wish I could say the same for your friend.