Highway code (UK) changes

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sometimewoodworker
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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by sometimewoodworker » March 23, 2022, 7:50 pm

Khun Paul wrote:
March 23, 2022, 3:55 pm
Drivers of vehicles are DUTY bound to have their Driving licence available upon request and if it is their vehicle it will be registered to them .
You are not correct on the subject of a driving license in the U.K. drivers are NOT required to carry their driving license with them. They are NOT “DUTY bound to have their Driving licence available upon request” the law in the USA (that it appears you are quoting) does not apply in the U.K. however much you may like to think that it does.

If a U.K. driver does not produce his driving license at the roadside (no requirement to do so, just more convenient) then he will receive a notice to produce it within 7 days at any police station. At that point (being stopped) no offence has been committed. The same is true for insurance certificate and MOT.

But don’t believe me, go to www.gov.uk under “Crime, justice and the law” and prove it for yourself.

That has nothing to do with the registration of the vehicle with the DVLA, of course if the vehicle belongs to a person they are required to register it with the DVLA


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Earnest
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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by Earnest » March 24, 2022, 2:39 am

Khun Paul wrote:
March 23, 2022, 3:55 pm
Oh dear not got our thinking caps on eh.
Drivers of vehicles are DUTY bound to have their Driving licence available upon request and if it is their vehicle it will be registered to them .
Hmm, maybe you mean Thailand, sir?
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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by pepesgrill » March 24, 2022, 6:08 am

KP has the final say. before you delinquents get
pulled out of your vehicles, and thrown on ground

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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by Bonanza » March 24, 2022, 6:52 am

Quote '.............and if it is their vehicle it will be registered to them.' Unquote. Not quite correct. The records held by the DVLA (and accessed by the Police) show the Registered Keeper of the vehicle. Ownership is by receipt for purchase or other similar document. The Registered Keeper and the Owner are not necessarily the same person. :D

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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by Khun Paul » March 24, 2022, 7:05 am

sometimewoodworker wrote:
March 23, 2022, 7:50 pm
Khun Paul wrote:
March 23, 2022, 3:55 pm
Drivers of vehicles are DUTY bound to have their Driving licence available upon request and if it is their vehicle it will be registered to them .
You are not correct on the subject of a driving license in the U.K. drivers are NOT required to carry their driving license with them. They are NOT “DUTY bound to have their Driving licence available upon request” the law in the USA (that it appears you are quoting) does not apply in the U.K. however much you may like to think that it does.

If a U.K. driver does not produce his driving license at the roadside (no requirement to do so, just more convenient) then he will receive a notice to produce it within 7 days at any police station. At that point (being stopped) no offence has been committed. The same is true for insurance certificate and MOT.

But don’t believe me, go to www.gov.uk under “Crime, justice and the law” and prove it for yourself.

That has nothing to do with the registration of the vehicle with the DVLA, of course if the vehicle belongs to a person they are required to register it with the DVLA

Okay smart-arse, any driver in the UK must upon receipt of the request produce a VALID Driving licence to a Police station nominated by him within 7 days . Now common-sense prevails if you are travelling around and your DRIVING LICENCE IS AT HOME THEN YOU WILL HAVE O RETURN TO PRODUCE, So 99% of drivers I ever stopped in 30 years always carried their driving licence to avoid having Problems. there was and is always one or two that thought being clever wouyld halt the process, however most then found failing to produce was a fine they WOULD have to pay. On top oif everything else
Vehicles driven by a keeper as opposed top the owner, the OWNER has a duty i9n LAW to provide details fo the driver or he also commits an offence.
What the law says and what normally happens is as different as chalk and cheese. Most people I ever dealt with had all the details so much easier, maybe you are one of the so-=called clever drivers who think they know better.

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Re: Highway code (UK) change

Post by sometimewoodworker » March 24, 2022, 8:39 am

Khun Paul wrote:
March 24, 2022, 7:05 am


Okay smart-arse, any driver in the UK must upon receipt of the request produce a VALID Driving licence to a Police station nominated by him within 7 days . Now common-sense prevails if you are travelling around and your DRIVING LICENCE IS AT HOME THEN YOU WILL HAVE O RETURN TO PRODUCE, So 99% of drivers I ever stopped in 30 years always carried their driving licence to avoid having Problems. there was and is always one or two that thought being clever wouyld halt the process, however most then found failing to produce was a fine they WOULD have to pay. On top oif everything else
Vehicles driven by a keeper as opposed top the owner, the OWNER has a duty i9n LAW to provide details fo the driver or he also commits an offence.
What the law says and what normally happens is as different as chalk and cheese. Most people I ever dealt with had all the details so much easier, maybe you are one of the so-=called clever drivers who think they know better.
You seem from your statements to have been one of the, thankfully few, Mr plods who possibly know the law but like to insist that interpretation is correct, when challenged thier fragile ego really really hates that. Even when the correct information is posted you wriggle and twist. AND NO, I don’t think I know better, I do know the letter of the law.

You should know better and not bring the law into disrepute by being economical with the truth.

I do know that failure to produce is an offence and that if you don’t have a license/insurance/MOT you commit offences and if you don’t produce you commit further offences and that you will be charged with those offences, however in the vast majority of cases when brought to court if the offender pleads guilty to not having, the CPS will dismiss the lesser charge of not producing.

Also NO you do not have to “RETURN TO PRODUCE” you can go to any police station within 7 days, usually you will know the most convenient one.

HMG
If you’re stopped, the police can ask to see your:

driving licence
insurance certificate
MOT certificate
If you do not have these documents with you, you have 7 days to take them to a police station.
I have met with the kind of fragile self important authoritarian officers you seem to be. On finding that what he thought to be an easy stop and ticket for improper wearing of my helmet was nothing of the sort to save face he then desperately went over every part of my motorcycle trying to discover anything he could for the next 10 to 20 minutes to no avail finally admitting that it was in perfect condition, his chagrin was obvious and could not even give advice on any non legal requirement. He was not chuffed.

Today with the credit card sized plastic license carrying it is no problem, it is a different case with the licenses I have and have had. My current one is about 42 years old, green paper, larger and more fragile than a passport so not conducive to being carried in a motorcycle jacket pocket.

The driver of a vehicle does not need to be either the owner or keeper of it. He is required to have the permission of the owner/keeper. He is required to have a license and insurance that covers his use of the vehicle and the vehicle must either have a current MOT or be exempt.
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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by tamada » March 24, 2022, 8:51 am

KP love - 30 STWW
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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by jackspratt » March 24, 2022, 9:11 am

More like Game, Set, and Match.

To continue on the tennis theme, KP should seriously consider joining Ash Barty. =D>

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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by Khun Paul » March 24, 2022, 9:38 am

Oh dear mis-reading again. I stated IF YOUR LICENCE IS AT HOME...try reading english.

If you are going to attempt to pillory me then learn to read the Queens English adopt some sort of understanding BEFORE you attempt an putdown.

You are correct normally but most people do not even carry their D/L, Ins/MOT only copies which I did , and if I left home for more than 3 days I took the originals with me to avoid the problems. Most people I know did. Makes common-sense, something many on here seem to be lacking !!!!!!

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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by Khun Paul » March 24, 2022, 9:40 am

Discussing English traffic law with idiots is a complete waste of time. I appreciate thigs have moved on but the basics remain the same, but some feel entitled to moan, make up stories or just be friggin stupid. whatever, enjoy the chat folks, I will l;;eave you to those who p[refer MIS-INFOMATION and sound-bites to the truth !!

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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by jackspratt » March 24, 2022, 9:46 am

Khun Paul wrote:
March 24, 2022, 9:40 am
Discussing English traffic law with idiots is a complete waste of time.
Yes, you are living proof of that.

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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by sometimewoodworker » March 24, 2022, 10:45 am

jackspratt wrote:
March 24, 2022, 9:46 am
Khun Paul wrote:
March 24, 2022, 9:40 am
Discussing English traffic law with idiots is a complete waste of time.
Yes, you are living proof of that.
Never were truer words spoken.

Despite the ample evidence to the contrary displayed by the former and thankfully no longer Mr Plod the majority of police officers are intelligent thoughtful respectable representatives of their office.

The overwhelming percentage of interactions I have had have been positive. Naturally the idiots are more memorable.

Regrettably there are a few who bring the force down.

Since lack of knowledge of the law is no excuse it is sensible to know the law, this knowledge is upsetting to pocket despots who want to, as self confessed, do something that is as different from the law as chalk and cheese.
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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by Khun Paul » March 24, 2022, 11:35 am

So easy to criticise, were you ever a Police Officer, did you ever have the temerity to tell an officer he was wrong .
None of things apply, I did say times have changed but as usual people pick out one sentence and make a mountain out of a molehill.
Typical keyboard warriors not even have the decency to speak face to9 face or even understand the written word.
This was originally about the Highway code NOT the law, and dealing with cyclists and their seemingly lack of rules governing their behaviour .
The Highway Code is NOT the LAW but can be used as a basis for looking at offences.
How many of you have actually read ALL of the Highway Code, or for that matter even studued Traffic Law, until then please be quiet.

So many loud mouths spiting off , you seem to be all equally suffering from a lack of something, not sure what . Safe in your own little environment . happy children. .

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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by Wee Jimmy » March 24, 2022, 12:05 pm

The Highway code is a code of good conduct and road discipline issued by the M.O.T and DVSA for the use of all road users and approved by Parliament.
Any rule using wording like "MUST" or "MUST NOT" is supported by a law, which will usually be referenced at the bottom of the sub-section.

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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by tamada » March 24, 2022, 12:48 pm

Khun Paul wrote:
March 24, 2022, 11:35 am
So easy to criticise, were you ever a Police Officer, did you ever have the temerity to tell an officer he was wrong .
None of things apply, I did say times have changed but as usual people pick out one sentence and make a mountain out of a molehill.
Typical keyboard warriors not even have the decency to speak face to9 face or even understand the written word.
This was originally about the Highway code NOT the law, and dealing with cyclists and their seemingly lack of rules governing their behaviour .
The Highway Code is NOT the LAW but can be used as a basis for looking at offences.
How many of you have actually read ALL of the Highway Code, or for that matter even studued Traffic Law, until then please be quiet.

So many loud mouths spiting off , you seem to be all equally suffering from a lack of something, not sure what . Safe in your own little environment . happy children. .
Christ on a bloody bike! Will you get off that "I was a policeman once" high bloody horse and just accept that your experience, like your low opinion of fellow members is totally bloody irrelevant and therefore doesn't bloody matter.

You are the one who chooses not to mix with fellow UM'ers socially so shut your bloody cake hole with your "decency to speak face to9 face" nonsense.

Bloody Tufty Club members!!! Don't even know how to run a bloody spell check either.

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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by Khun Paul » March 24, 2022, 2:39 pm

For information :

Power of constables to require production of driving licence and in certain cases statement of date of birth
(1)Any of the following persons—
(a)a person driving a motor vehicle on a road,
(b)a person whom a constable has reasonable cause to believe to have been the driver of a motor vehicle at a time when an accident occurred owing to its presence on a road,
(c)a person whom a constable has reasonable cause to believe to have committed an offence in relation to the use of a motor vehicle on a road, or
(d)a person—
(i)who supervises the holder of a provisional licence while the holder is driving a motor vehicle on a road, or
(ii)whom a constable has reasonable cause to believe was supervising the holder of a provisional licence while driving, at a time when an accident occurred owing to the presence of the vehicle on a road or at a time when an offence is suspected of having been committed by the holder of the provisional licence in relation to the use of the vehicle on a road,must, on being so required by a constable, produce his licence for examination, so as to enable the constable to ascertain the name and address of the holder of the licence, the date of issue, and the authority by which it was issued.
(2)Such a person must in prescribed circumstances, on being so required by the constable, state his date of birth.
(3)If—
(a)a licence has been revoked by the Secretary of State under section 93 or 99 of this Act, and
(b)the holder of the licence fails to deliver it to the Secretary of State in pursuance of the section in question,a constable may require him to produce it, and upon its being produced may seize it and deliver it to the Secretary of State.
(4)Where a constable has reasonable cause to believe that the holder of a licence, or any other person, has knowingly made a false statement for the purpose of obtaining the grant of the licence, the constable may require the holder of the licence to produce it to him.
(5)Where a person has been required under section 27 of the [1988 c. 53.] Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988 to produce a licence to the court and fails to do so, a constable may require him to produce it and, upon its being produced, may seize it and deliver it to the court.
(6)If a person required under the preceding provisions of this section to produce a licence or state his date of birth to a constable fails to do so he is, subject to subsections (7) and (8) below, guilty of an offence.
(7)Subsection (6) above does not apply where a person required on any occasion under the preceding provisions of this section to produce a licence—
(a)produces on that occasion a current receipt for the licence issued under section 56 of the [1988 c. 53.] Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988 and, if required to do so, produces the licence in person immediately on its return at a police station that was specified on that occasion, or
(b)within seven days after that occasion produces such a receipt in person at a police station that was specified by him on that occasion and, if required to do so, produces the licence in person immediately on its return at that police station.
(8)In proceedings against any person for the offence of failing to produce a licence it shall be a defence for him to show that—
(a)within seven days after the production of his licence was required he produced it in person at a police station that was specified by him at the time its production was required, or
(b)he produced it in person there as soon as was reasonably practicable, or
(c)it was not reasonably practicable for him to produce it there before the day on which the proceedings were commenced,and for the purposes of this subsection the laying of the information or, in Scotland, the service of the complaint on the accused shall be treated as the commencement of the proceedings.
(9)Where in accordance with this section a person has stated his date of birth to a constable, the Secretary of State may serve on that person a notice in writing requiring him to provide the Secretary of State—
(a)with such evidence in that person’s possession or obtainable by him as the Secretary of State may specify for the purpose of verifying that date, and
(b)if his name differs from his name at the time of his birth, with a statement in writing specifying his name at that time,and a person who knowingly fails to comply with a notice under this subsection is guilty of an offence.
(10)A notice authorised to be served on any person by subsection (9) above may be served on him by delivering it to him or by leaving it at his proper address or by sending it to him by post; and for the purposes of this subsection and section 7 of the Interpretation Act 1978[1978 c. 30.] in its application to this subsection the proper address of any person shall be his latest address as known to the person giving the notice.
(11)In this section “licence” and “provisional licence” have the same meanings as in Part III of this Act.

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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by Khun Paul » March 24, 2022, 2:40 pm

tamada wrote:
March 24, 2022, 12:48 pm
Khun Paul wrote:
March 24, 2022, 11:35 am
So easy to criticise, were you ever a Police Officer, did you ever have the temerity to tell an officer he was wrong .
None of things apply, I did say times have changed but as usual people pick out one sentence and make a mountain out of a molehill.
Typical keyboard warriors not even have the decency to speak face to9 face or even understand the written word.
This was originally about the Highway code NOT the law, and dealing with cyclists and their seemingly lack of rules governing their behaviour .
The Highway Code is NOT the LAW but can be used as a basis for looking at offences.
How many of you have actually read ALL of the Highway Code, or for that matter even studued Traffic Law, until then please be quiet.

So many loud mouths spiting off , you seem to be all equally suffering from a lack of something, not sure what . Safe in your own little environment . happy children. .
Christ on a bloody bike! Will you get off that "I was a policeman once" high bloody horse and just accept that your experience, like your low opinion of fellow members is totally bloody irrelevant and therefore doesn't bloody matter.

You are the one who chooses not to mix with fellow UM'ers socially so shut your bloody cake hole with your "decency to speak face to9 face" nonsense.

Bloody Tufty Club members!!! Don't even know how to run a bloody spell check either.

(good job I have some bombs left over from earlier)
Thankyou for your illiterate comments

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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by stattointhailand » March 24, 2022, 2:55 pm

Seems like a hell of a load of cages getting rattled by a simple thread about changes being made to how pedestrians cross the bl***dy road

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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by Khun Paul » March 24, 2022, 3:16 pm

stattointhailand wrote:
March 24, 2022, 2:55 pm
Seems like a hell of a load of cages getting rattled by a simple thread about changes being made to how pedestrians cross the bl***dy road
Caused mainly by those who always seek to derail a sensible post

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Re: Highway code (UK) changes

Post by Earnest » March 24, 2022, 5:05 pm

Quite amusing, everyone huffing, puffing and posturing and some of you don't live in the UK on a permanent basis.

Keep it up, it's funny.
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