4 Police killed by snipers in Dallas,Texas

[Lone Star]

.

[MrFixer]

... non Yanks really shouldn't try to comment or understand what happens in or about the USA, as I wouldn't try to understand and / or comment on non Yank 'culture' in your F'd up countries......fearing I would look and sound just as silly as a non yank commenting on USA 'culture'.

Ditto.

James T. Harris can educate those who have no clue.

Whilst I understand this sentiment it has not historically stopped the US from not only commenting on other 'cultures' but getting involved in trying to change them. Most of the problems Europe is experiencing with refugees and terrorists from Muslim countries has arisen as a consequence of the US interference in the Middle East.

The Baton Rouge shooting looks pretty close to summary execution (in any culture) and would have various US government agencies jumping up and down about human rights abuses if it had happened in certain other countries.

[Lone Star]

.

[MrFixer]

Most of the problems Europe is experiencing with refugees and terrorists from Muslim countries has arisen as a consequence of the US interference in the Middle East.

You're talking about governments. Have at it. There are a lot of things that the US government does that the citizens do not support. That's not what this is about. I'm talking about individuals responding to America's domestic and social issues within the borders of America with little background and knowledge other than repeating talking points.

I'm not repeating any talking points. I suggest you check out the video of the Baton Rouge shooting - I don't need any specialist background knowledge to understand what happened.
I have lived and worked in the US so I am aware that there is a lot of anger and agression in US society -Americans 'live on the edge' much moreso than most Europeans. I am also aware that violent crime is disproportionately concentrated into black and Hispanic neighbourhoods. Not an easy job being a cop that's for sure.

[Lone Star]

.

[Jello]

The Alton shooting, stun gun used first, didn't work and the fight was on. Then one of the cop yells gun the shots began. Looks like it went to hell in a hand basket at that point. Whoever fired the second volley of rounds has some answering to do.

Here's a eyewitness report of the Alton Sterling killing. The reporter also states that the coroners report shows he was shot in the chest and in the back.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CABRcX0CUdA

Now that is what I see. I can't speak to the passenger shooting hopefully the cops had body cams on.

I think if the body cam footage shows that the victim did something aggressive to warrant the killing then they would release it to quell the current protests going on throughout the country.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yc3mWwzMY8A

[Jello]

Watch the video of James T. Harris...

Valid points, but the issue isn't what's wrong with black culture. The issue is the overuse of deadly force by the police.

As foolish as it may be to not comply with the officers demands is should not warrant an execution if the officer is not in mortal danger.

[Lone Star]

.

[Charlieb]

Cops killed nearly twice as many whites as blacks in 2015. According to data compiled by The Washington Post, 50 percent of the victims of fatal police shootings were white, while 26 percent were black. The majority of these victims had a gun or "were armed or otherwise threatening the officer with potentially lethal force," according to MacDonald in a speech at Hillsdale College.

http://www.dailywire.com/news/7264/5-st ... on-bandler

[tigerryan]

Watch the video of James T. Harris...

Valid points, but the issue isn't what's wrong with black culture. The issue is the overuse of deadly force by the police.

As foolish as it may be to not comply with the officers demands is should not warrant an execution if the officer is not in mortal danger.

This is where the rubber meets the road. It simply is not possible to react to a aggressor with a concealed weapon that chooses to shoot you...why? you don't have enough time it happens in less than one second. Are police officers reasonably required to get shot to demonstrate the other guys intent? This is why police are always screaming "Show Me Your Hands". If the guy will not comply with the officers orders the officer must assume he is less than one second away from being shot in the face and there is nothing that can change this reality this is where the officer is thinking about his life not yours!. All of this lofty healing and better training stuff is not going to do much if anything. I wish someone like Obama would just come out and in the most direct way say you must obey police officers orders in a calm way and show the officer your hands. That's it and it would do the most good but instead people are being encouraged to resist the police The person that goes for his gun first always wins in a gun fight! I understand people that are not familiar with weapons and tactics don't understand but you really need to try harder

[socksy]

The non-white (my politically correct training coming out) communities coming out in force onto the streets to protestdo not help whatsoever. Particularly in run down communities in London where the reaction in the majority of the cases is the same ie Tottenham and Brixton. My personal gut feeling and I make no apology for saying it, is that a lot of people from these communities, and I have worked in neighbouring ---- holes, have a large, not chip, but a full grown individual Edward on their shoulders.

[socksy]

Another viewpoint. Lengthy but worth a read and in my opinion very well written

http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-36777582

[papafarang]

The non-white (my politically correct training coming out) communities coming out in force onto the streets to protestdo not help whatsoever. Particularly in run down communities in London where the reaction in the majority of the cases is the same ie Tottenham and Brixton. My personal gut feeling and I make no apology for saying it, is that a lot of people from these communities, and I have worked in neighbouring **** holes, have a large, not chip, but a full grown individual Edward on their shoulders.

actually I grew up in Brixton , the only problem I ever had there was with creepy motherfugin white folk ****'s , come to think about it , the crackers were the ones to avoid
oh yeh what was that ....no idea of inner city problems ... born and raised . lived on an estate (project) finally moved out in 77

[socksy]

PF Yeah seventy seven is a long time before the nineties when I worked in neighbouring St reatham. An absolute Toilet but the difference was that you were a local living in Brixton and the dealings I had mainly were with scum, slag, pondlife and I'm not talking about the freelance street ***** of Tooting Bec Common

[papafarang]

PF Yeah seventy seven is a long time before the nineties when I worked in neighbouring St reatham. An absolute Toilet but the difference was that you were a local living in Brixton and the dealings I had mainly were with scum, slag, pondlife and I'm not talking about the freelance street ***** of Tooting Bec Common

hey what you saying socksy. we thought we were upper class when we moved from Brixton to Tooting Bec, I always wondered why mum had to go to work in the evenings down at the common ?

[socksy]

It was the Streatham side of the Common that was the problem PF - yours was upmarket.

[bumper]

I think if the body cam footage shows that the victim did something aggressive to warrant the killing then they would release it to quell the current protests going on throughout the country.

Sounds good in theory. But, what happens if the decide to prosecute. Play all over the news paste on the internet. Whats the chances of getting an unbiased jury??????

You have to remember has the same rights as anyone else.

Where does it differ the policy of the department he works for.

As I recall years ago some Police Representative units were calling for the cop not to talk and to ask for an attorney.

I still don't know who was right or wrong, I haven't seen enough to come to a conclusion.

I have saw a few things in here that caught my attention why did they shoot more then one time, cause there are a lot of people out there that one bullet wouldn't stop. Sorry that is a movie view of life not real.

Three on the front three in the back sounds like both officers shot. You know you just can't apply a fair fight to a street fight. For the most part in my training I was trained to fire three rounds two the chest and one to the head. Think about this if things are so bad you have to shoot you better meant to kill the guy. Cause if you don't mean to do that, then you have no reason to shoot. Maybe that is why I never shot anyone.

This a topic talked about in one way or another for fifty years an will probably be talked about for another 50.

The had a town hall on CNN this morning anyone else watch it?

[papafarang]

It was the Streatham side of the Common that was the problem PF - yours was upmarket.

we were up on Franciscan rd, were the nut house was, strange people in there for sure.
anyway I've always got on with black people. one thing I can say is people black or white adapt to their environment, education and housing. you could say the problems of today are from social engineering from the past . how to change attitudes , that's the problem. first thing that should be outlawed is referring to people as black or white, that's the first social division, it should be illegal to call someone black or white, those killed by police should be together.
one thing did surprise me was, out of the 100,000,000's traffic stops every year only 7 officers were killed in shootings, in fact being a policeman in America is a very safe job. someone else can look it up ,but I think the numbers are like this. in fact driving cars and eating doughnuts kills more police than guns. the figures show being a policeman in the states is only slightly more dangerous than operating a lawn mower.

http://time.com/4326676/dangerous-jobs-america/

9/11 related illness: 8
Accidental: 2
Aircraft accident: 1
Assault: 3
Automobile accident: 27
Bomb: 6
Drowned: 1
Duty related illness: 2
Fall: 1
Gunfire: 39
Gunfire (Accidental): 2
Heart attack: 17
Motorcycle accident: 3
Struck by vehicle: 4
Vehicle pursuit: 5
Vehicular assault: 8
Weather/Natural disaster: 1

[Lone Star]

.

[Jello]

This is where the rubber meets the road. It simply is not possible to react to a aggressor with a concealed weapon that chooses to shoot you...why? you don't have enough time it happens in less than one second.

Sure, anyone should be able to understand that. As in the Alton Sterling shooting the situation degenerated to a point that the officer had little choice. My question is can the police handle the situation better before it gets to the point that a shooting is necessary.

If you believe the store owner according to his eyewitness report, the officers approached Alton by grabbing him and throwing him on a car. He also said the before Alto was thrown to the ground that he was still asking the officers "what did I do wrong"? So if the police start out with an aggression level of 10, where's it going from there? Why not start at a aggression level of 5 and adjust according? Could produce a different result.

Just from what I've read, police training in the UK is longer and more involved than the US. https://www.quora.com/How-do-UK-police- ... -US-police
They put a emphasis on de-escalation. I understand that the UK is a completely different society, but some of there better practices could be considered.
http://news.sky.com/story/scots-police- ... e-10151069

Three on the front three in the back sounds like both officers shot.

I also thought that some of the bullets could have hit the pavement while the victim was prone and entered through his back. Close range. Lots of movement and tussling. Bullets do funny things.

In the video you see the three shots to the chest, the camera pulls away when you hear 3 more. My guess is that Alton sat up at that point and the 2nd officer fired 3 more shots to his back.