Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, some better news for married folk

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ajarnudon
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Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, some better news for married folk

Post by ajarnudon » February 22, 2019, 7:59 pm

https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A% ... HpRr8T2Ie0

I can see a lot of retired expats returning home, and lots more selling vehicles and condos. And I think a lot might get married soon. The grandfathering decision is to be applauded, and hopefully will protect married folk when the ante is upped for marriage visas.



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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, some better news for married folk

Post by Lone Star » February 22, 2019, 8:08 pm

Looks good to me. Thanks!
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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, some better news for married folk

Post by sometimewoodworker » February 22, 2019, 8:32 pm

ajarnudon wrote:
February 22, 2019, 7:59 pm
https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A% ... HpRr8T2Ie0

I can see a lot of retired expats returning home, and lots more selling vehicles and condos. And I think a lot might get married soon. The grandfathering decision is to be applauded, and hopefully will protect married folk when the ante is upped for marriage visas.
There is nothing new here and the information has been posted already. There is no change if you already park 800k in the bank or are not national of the UK, US, Australia or Denmark using the income method.

The grandfather clause is just a continuation of a 20 year old one and it is the only one that has been put in place. The marriage/child extension was not grandfathered the last time it was changed.
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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, some better news for married folk

Post by ajarnudon » February 22, 2019, 9:34 pm

As you say the information was posted here earlier, but the 400K all year round was news to me, and posting it again might assist some who, like me, missed it first time around. I have never heard of an extension granted for someone with a recently deceased spouse - this seems so new that even Pattaya IO aren't sure about it. Heaven forbid that my younger wife should predecease me, but with nearly all of my assets now invested in the house I am building for her, it is very relevant in my situation. One may have to consider an 800K insurance policy on her life. In respect of grandfathering, the current mindset seems to be to keep money flowing into the country. The reverse will happen if married expats are forced to leave and their families left destitute, and there would certainly be a community backlash from the extended families left in these circumstances.
I do however stand by my observations of actions which may become more common among expat retirees.

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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, no change for married folk

Post by sometimewoodworker » February 23, 2019, 7:46 am

ajarnudon wrote:
February 22, 2019, 9:34 pm
As you say the information was posted here earlier, but the 400K all year round was news to me, and posting it again might assist some who, like me, missed it first time around. I have never heard of an extension granted for someone with a recently deceased spouse - this seems so new that even Pattaya IO aren't sure about it. Heaven forbid that my younger wife should predecease me, but with nearly all of my assets now invested in the house I am building for her, it is very relevant in my situation. One may have to consider an 800K insurance policy on her life. In respect of grandfathering, the current mindset seems to be to keep money flowing into the country. The reverse will happen if married expats are forced to leave and their families left destitute, and there would certainly be a community backlash from the extended families left in these circumstances.
I do however stand by my observations of actions which may become more common among expat retirees.
There is nothing in the new (or old) rules that permits an extension for a deceased spouse as the requirement is
(3) In the case of spouse, the relationship must be de jure and de facto


The exclusion for a recently deceased spouse is the same as a living one and relates to maintaining cash in the bank, it is not about issuing an extension.

The only reason a recently deceased spouse is mentioned is to allow the exsisting extension to continue. All other extensions terminate the day the reason they were given ends. Though they end, in usual cases nobody's checking so they can be used until they expire.
The Jan 18 order, issued by Immigration Bureau Deputy Commissioner Maj Gen Sarayut Sangonpokai, also made special mention that the new provisions specifically do not apply to:
– People who have Thai families
– People supporting Thai families
– People whose spouses have (recently) passed away
Last edited by sometimewoodworker on February 23, 2019, 8:40 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, some better news for married folk

Post by Chuchi » February 23, 2019, 7:55 am

I am on an extension of stay based on retirement,I have a Thai child who I support should I be considering this option for extension? Would it mean leaving the country and obtaining a new non immigrant O visa ?

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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, no change for married folk

Post by sometimewoodworker » February 23, 2019, 8:29 am

Chuchi wrote:
February 23, 2019, 7:55 am
I am on an extension of stay based on retirement,I have a Thai child who I support should I be considering this option for extension? Would it mean leaving the country and obtaining a new non immigrant O visa ?
As long as you meet all the requirements for supporting a Thai child and you are the legal parent {biological parents are not automatically legal parents}(section 4 under) then you certainly can (possibly should) change the reason for your extension, you do not have to get a new Non-O, you just change the reason the next time you extend.
4) In the case of children, adopted children, or spouse's children, said children, adopted children, or spouse's children must not be married, must live with the alien as part of the family, and must not be over 20 years of age except in case of the person hereof is of illness or disability and cannot live without support of father or mother
The rules are not completely clear as to the relationship requirements for children.
Last edited by sometimewoodworker on February 23, 2019, 8:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, some better news for married folk

Post by Chuchi » February 23, 2019, 8:37 am

sometimewoodworker wrote:
February 23, 2019, 8:29 am
Chuchi wrote:
February 23, 2019, 7:55 am
I am on an extension of stay based on retirement,I have a Thai child who I support should I be considering this option for extension? Would it mean leaving the country and obtaining a new non immigrant O visa ?
As long as you meet all the requirements for supporting a Thai child and you are the legal parent {biological parents are not automatically legal parents}(section 4 under) then you certainly can (possibly should) change the reason for your extension, you do not have to get a new Non-O, you just change the reason the next time you extend.
4) In the case of children, adopted children, or spouse's children, said children, adopted children, or spouse's children must not be married, must live with the alien as part of the family, and must not be over 20 years of age except in case of the person hereof is of illness or disability and cannot live without support of father or mother

Thanks again STW it’s something I’ll go and discuss with immigration in the near future, I’ve just renewed my visa before the deadline so I’m assuming the new rules will be for my next extension which should give me plenty of time to make an enquiry.

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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, no change for married folk

Post by sometimewoodworker » February 23, 2019, 8:45 am

Chuchi wrote:
February 23, 2019, 8:37 am
sometimewoodworker wrote:
February 23, 2019, 8:29 am
Chuchi wrote:
February 23, 2019, 7:55 am
I am on an extension of stay based on retirement,I have a Thai child who I support should I be considering this option for extension? Would it mean leaving the country and obtaining a new non immigrant O visa ?
As long as you meet all the requirements for supporting a Thai child and you are the legal parent {biological parents are not automatically legal parents}(section 4 under) then you certainly can (possibly should) change the reason for your extension, you do not have to get a new Non-O, you just change the reason the next time you extend.
4) In the case of children, adopted children, or spouse's children, said children, adopted children, or spouse's children must not be married, must live with the alien as part of the family, and must not be over 20 years of age except in case of the person hereof is of illness or disability and cannot live without support of father or mother

Thanks again STW it’s something I’ll go and discuss with immigration in the near future, I’ve just renewed my visa before the deadline so I’m assuming the new rules will be for my next extension which should give me plenty of time to make an enquiry.
Correct.

Don't forget that if you use income and are one of the 4 affected you must start transfers in from abroad now, also there is no combination method for any other extension than retirement.
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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, no change for married folk

Post by Chuchi » February 23, 2019, 8:57 am

sometimewoodworker wrote:
February 23, 2019, 8:45 am
Chuchi wrote:
February 23, 2019, 8:37 am
sometimewoodworker wrote:
February 23, 2019, 8:29 am
Chuchi wrote:
February 23, 2019, 7:55 am
I am on an extension of stay based on retirement,I have a Thai child who I support should I be considering this option for extension? Would it mean leaving the country and obtaining a new non immigrant O visa ?
As long as you meet all the requirements for supporting a Thai child and you are the legal parent {biological parents are not automatically legal parents}(section 4 under) then you certainly can (possibly should) change the reason for your extension, you do not have to get a new Non-O, you just change the reason the next time you extend.
4) In the case of children, adopted children, or spouse's children, said children, adopted children, or spouse's children must not be married, must live with the alien as part of the family, and must not be over 20 years of age except in case of the person hereof is of illness or disability and cannot live without support of father or mother

Thanks again STW it’s something I’ll go and discuss with immigration in the near future, I’ve just renewed my visa before the deadline so I’m assuming the new rules will be for my next extension which should give me plenty of time to make an enquiry.
Correct.

Don't forget that if you use income and are one of the 4 affected you must start transfers in from abroad now, also there is no combination method for any other extension than retirement.
Thanks again at the moment I’m in a position to meet the fixed payment but it would be great if it could be reduced in the future,the Thai child route looks a good option.

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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, some better news for married folk

Post by jackspratt » February 23, 2019, 9:20 am

It would be nice to hear of anyone who has been successful with their retirement extension at Udon, based on the combination method.

Historically, to my understanding, Udon has refused such applications.

Utilising the combination, it also seems unclear about details such as seasoning, monthly transfers, and maintaining funds in the account after the date of the extension.

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Re: Latest news release from Phuket Immigration - Bad news for retirees, some better news for married folk

Post by karonsteve » February 23, 2019, 11:08 am

Phuket not Pattaya.

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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, no change for married folk

Post by pipoz4444 » February 23, 2019, 12:11 pm

[/quote]
Thanks again STW it’s something I’ll go and discuss with immigration in the near future, I’ve just renewed my visa before the deadline so I’m assuming the new rules will be for my next extension which should give me plenty of time to make an enquiry.
[/quote]

Correct.
Don't forget that if you use income and are one of the 4 affected you must start transfers in from abroad now, also there is no combination method for any other extension than retirement.
[/quote]

Hi STWW,

By the 4 affected are you referring to the four Countries "UK, US, Australia or Denmark"

Regards

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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, no change for married folk

Post by sometimewoodworker » February 23, 2019, 2:31 pm

pipoz4444 wrote:
February 23, 2019, 12:11 pm

Hi STWW,

By the 4 affected are you referring to the four Countries "UK, US, Australia or Denmark"

Regards

pipoz4444
Yes, exactly.

FWIW There has also been a report of a German being refused an extension on Thai bank deposits who was told to get an embassy letter.
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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, no change for married folk

Post by pipoz4444 » February 23, 2019, 4:28 pm

sometimewoodworker wrote:
February 23, 2019, 2:31 pm
pipoz4444 wrote:
February 23, 2019, 12:11 pm

Hi STWW,

By the 4 affected are you referring to the four Countries "UK, US, Australia or Denmark"

Regards

pipoz4444
Yes, exactly.

FWIW There has also been a report of a German being refused an extension on Thai bank deposits who was told to get an embassy letter.
OK thanks STWW

But if I am reading all this correct, then for an Australian who has parked his TB 800,000 in a Thai Bank and had at or above the TB 800,000 continuously for the past year then, It is all that is required and so presumably, WHEN IT COMES TIME FOR ME TO RENEW MY NON IMM O-A VISA AND OR MY RETIREMENT VISA (When I do decide to apply for one), then Thai Immigration in Udon Thani,

Q1. Don't care and don't wish to see any proof of where his monthly income for living, is coming from?
Q2. Specifically will not want to see any proof that a monthly income stream is coming in from Outside of Thailand/Overseas, by way of regular monthly Deposits from Overseas?
Q3. Don't wish to see any letter from the Australian Embassy related to what my monthly income may be or not be from outside Thailand. For all they care I might have it stashed under my bed.

Please, if I am reading this correct, is this correct

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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, no change for married folk

Post by sometimewoodworker » February 23, 2019, 8:04 pm

pipoz4444 wrote:
February 23, 2019, 4:28 pm

OK thanks STWW

But if I am reading all this correct, then for an Australian who has parked his TB 800,000 in a Thai Bank and had at or above the TB 800,000 continuously for the past year then, It is all that is required and so presumably, WHEN IT COMES TIME FOR ME TO RENEW MY NON IMM O-A VISA AND OR MY RETIREMENT VISA (When I do decide to apply for one), then Thai Immigration in Udon Thani,

Q1. Don't care and don't wish to see any proof of where his monthly income for living, is coming from?
Q2. Specifically will not want to see any proof that a monthly income stream is coming in from Outside of Thailand/Overseas, by way of regular monthly Deposits from Overseas?
Q3. Don't wish to see any letter from the Australian Embassy related to what my monthly income may be or not be from outside Thailand. For all they care I might have it stashed under my bed.

Please, if I am reading this correct, is this correct

pipoz4444
Your basic idea is correct but the terminology is not.
Visas can never be renewed. You can only get a new visa
Visas are never (except in 1 special case though the EV may be a second) issued by Thai immigration.

A visa does not give permission to stay in Thailand.
A visa is something that an immigration officer at your port of entry consults when deciding on the length of the permission to stay to give you

The permission to stay granted by the port of entry IO can be extended at the immigration offices in Thailand. The reasons for extension for any Non-O (Non-O single entry, Non-O multiple entry, Non-OA ) are usually retirement, marriage, support of child (and can be support of parents)

If you decide to park 800,000 in a bank in Thailand (in your name only), minimum 2 months before your first extension of your permission to stay and don't bother to use it, that is the only requirement for you to be issued an extension of permission to stay "for the purpose of retirement" each year.

If you have 800k parked Some offices may ask to see that you are getting money and spending it, if they do you do not have to prove where it is coming from, if it's from your under bed stash you should pay it into a bank before using it. :shock:

Opinion:
I suggest an account for the 800k that is different to your regular usage account. There are accounts that pay 2.7% for a 48 month term that are acceptable to Udon Immigration.

FWIW For this years extension my account will pay 1.3% as I didn't have enough time to set up the longer term one.

A1) they don't care
A2) they don't care
A3) you can not get any such document from the Australian embassy now
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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, some better news for married folk

Post by pipoz4444 » February 23, 2019, 8:45 pm

Thanks STWW and at this time, I have opted to park the TB 800k in, what is referred to as a - FDC Account for Non Residents, "Current Account" at No Interest.

May do one with The Bangkok Public Bank in May, now that I have my Non Immigrant O A. Last month, the Bangkok Public Bank didn't want to talk to me until I had my O A.
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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, some better news for married folk

Post by Nev » February 23, 2019, 10:37 pm

Hi,

A Lot Of Guys on this site talk Bollocks and have done for years !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

TA.

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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, some better news for married folk

Post by sometimewoodworker » February 23, 2019, 10:55 pm

pipoz4444 wrote:
February 23, 2019, 8:45 pm
Thanks STWW and at this time, I have opted to park the TB 800k in, what is referred to as a - FDC Account for Non Residents, "Current Account" at No Interest.

May do one with The Bangkok Public Bank in May, now that I have my Non Immigrant O A. Last month, the Bangkok Public Bank didn't want to talk to me until I had my O A.
Bangkok bank like SCB will give 0.5%

.Krungsri (Bank of Ayudhya) Savings Mee Tae Dai Deposit will pay 1.3%
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Re: Latest news release from Pattaya Immigration - Bad news for retirees, some better news for married folk

Post by pipoz4444 » February 23, 2019, 11:15 pm

sometimewoodworker wrote:
February 23, 2019, 10:55 pm
pipoz4444 wrote:
February 23, 2019, 8:45 pm
Thanks STWW and at this time, I have opted to park the TB 800k in, what is referred to as a - FDC Account for Non Residents, "Current Account" at No Interest.

May do one with The Bangkok Public Bank in May, now that I have my Non Immigrant O A. Last month, the Bangkok Public Bank didn't want to talk to me until I had my O A.
Bangkok bank like SCB will give 0.5%

.Krungsri (Bank of Ayudhya) Savings Mee Tae Dai Deposit will pay 1.3%

Thanks STWW
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