A little ray of sunshine from Australia

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Whistler
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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by Whistler » August 3, 2020, 11:16 am

papafarang wrote:
August 3, 2020, 3:53 am
Its a shame really ,it was looking good for a while
What it has shown in Victoria as well as other places in the world, is that without 100% co-operation, stopping Covid is not possible. Slow down yes, but then flare-ups even in countries with sensible regulations, it will be nigh on impossible. Nut jobs who blame it on G5, anti-vaxers, the defiant, the lazy and the just-don't-cares all thwart the best efforts of authorities.

Then there is the USA where nothing makes sense.

I am coming to the conclusion that we will live with this menace for a very long time.


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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by noosard » August 3, 2020, 11:19 am

pipoz4444 wrote:
August 3, 2020, 11:02 am
So, for 2 months from late April to late June you have under 20 No new cases being recorded for most days, with many days reporting under 10 No new cases a day, and presumably all of these new cases being quarantined. So what or who triggered the spike in new cases/spread in the last week of June.

There doesn't seem to be much explanation by the Victorian Government as to the potential/likely reason behind this "Outbreak", after almost two months of relative calm (other than that indicated by the BBC News in the Link below).

https://www.google.com/search?q=covid+1 ... e&ie=UTF-8


Extract: Initially, Mr Andrews pinpointed the origin of many infections to security guards who reportedly broke lockdown rules while overseeing hotel quarantines.

Health experts say the relaxation of rules, complacency on social distancing and sheer bad luck have all contributed to Victoria's rise in cases.

Now Mr Andrews says the current rate of community transmission - including "mystery cases" that cannot be traced back to work or home - is far too high.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-53627038


pipoz4444
The problem was the security guards spread it to both known and unknown people
The unknown could have beeen asymptomatic so cant trace
These asymptomatic people could pass the virus to lots of different people at different places
Wild fire
Then you got the ones that have the virus and dont stay in isolation, but go to work

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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia... and the UK.

Post by tamada » August 3, 2020, 12:41 pm

So how did the virus spread? Allegations of blame have been levelled at private security firms contracted to operate the state's quarantine. Neighbouring New South Wales took a different approach - using the police force.

Victoria has faced accusations of systemic failures such as guards being improperly trained or not given enough PPE.

Mr Andrews has also described cases of illegal socialising between staff, listing examples of workers sharing a cigarette lighter or car-pooling. Local media also reported claims of sex between guards and quarantined travellers.

The government has ordered a judicial inquiry into their quarantine operation and fired the contractors.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-53259356

Wasn't New Zealand's sudden spike a couple of months back due to inefficient quarantine hotel security and oversight by a contractor? I recall they eventually handed that role over to the military.

I think the UK government awarded their £90m Covid test and trace contract to Serco, a private company that had previously been fined over £19m for cocking-up on an at least two earlier government contracts.

The UK's test and trace program has been laughably slow and inefficient with a common complaint by contact tracers that they haven't been trained while others haven't been able to access their own systems. They got hired, sit at home doing bugger all and the government gets billed. Interestingly enough, the grounds for one of Serco's previous fines over malfeasance with their refugee-handling contract have never been disclosed and efforts to seek the details of this via the freedom of information act have been denied.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... te-1m-fine

Those wishing to complain about the current award have basically been told to pursue it through the same stymied legal process.

"openDemocracy asked the government to clarify the procurement process and the scope of works that Serco is carrying out – but the DWP declined to answer our questions. Instead, the department has insisted we raise a freedom of information request, a lengthy process with no guarantee of an answer"

https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/dark-m ... -contract/

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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by GT93 » August 3, 2020, 12:57 pm

You can have awesome systems in place but a super spreader coming along at the wrong time can overwhelm all that. Most of the time though it will be lazy halfwits doing the damage. The experts in NZ expect Covid 19 to reappear here at some stage. We seem to have been lucky recently. It's now over 90 days with no community transmission. Melbourne's experience reinforces the need to apply restrictions very early. The other Aussie states will have noticed that.

Quarantining / isolation needs to be regularly tweaked to keep improving it. We started just with health officials and quarantined people felt free to ignore them. We now have a police officer (and the military) at each quarantine site but a nutbar tries to break out at least once a week.

I don't think it's an option just to do a Trump and let the virus rip through a country. It causes too many deaths and too much economic damage. Countries need to work to keep the R rate satisfactorily below 1. I think restrictions will be coming and going for years. I also think the first vaccines will be of limited effectiveness.
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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by papafarang » August 3, 2020, 3:21 pm

We're all doomed I tell ya. People not co operating ,governments not co operating . nut jobs ,conspiracy theories , fake cures and treatments . maybe the aliens are right . no intelligent life on earth ,just a bunch of Monkees dead set on destruction of themselves . our only hope is new Zealand isolates itself so in 50 years when everything has gone they can repopulate the planet :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by noosard » August 3, 2020, 3:45 pm

New Zealand passports most powerful in world post-COVID

The New Zealand passport is now the most valuable travel document in the world, according to a new global ranking.

The new ranking by the Passport Index, which comes amid general travel chaos caused by COVID-19, puts the Kiwi passport in joint first place alongside Japan, with both passports granting visa free travel or visa on arrival to 118 countries, The New Zealand Herald reports.

Australia was second on the list, tied with 11 other nations including the United Kingdom, Germany and South Korea.

Perhaps no passport has fallen from grace so quickly as the American travel document.

The US passport which previously granted visa-free access to nearly 170 countries has fallen to 21 in the rankings, with just 80 countries not imposing restrictions on American tourists.

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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by Whistler » August 3, 2020, 5:36 pm

papafarang wrote:
August 3, 2020, 3:21 pm
We're all doomed I tell ya. People not co operating ,governments not co operating . nut jobs ,conspiracy theories , fake cures and treatments . maybe the aliens are right . no intelligent life on earth ,just a bunch of Monkees dead set on destruction of themselves . our only hope is new Zealand isolates itself so in 50 years when everything has gone they can repopulate the planet :lol: :lol: :lol:
OMG Papa.

Thun thu ownly Inglish wull bee spokun liyke thus. Unglish speeykers cunnot evun orda Fish, only fush & chups wull bee on thu minu
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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by papafarang » August 3, 2020, 10:20 pm

Whistler wrote:
August 3, 2020, 5:36 pm
papafarang wrote:
August 3, 2020, 3:21 pm
We're all doomed I tell ya. People not co operating ,governments not co operating . nut jobs ,conspiracy theories , fake cures and treatments . maybe the aliens are right . no intelligent life on earth ,just a bunch of Monkees dead set on destruction of themselves . our only hope is new Zealand isolates itself so in 50 years when everything has gone they can repopulate the planet :lol: :lol: :lol:
OMG Papa.

Thun thu ownly Inglish wull bee spokun liyke thus. Unglish speeykers cunnot evun orda Fish, only fush & chups wull bee on thu minu
Yes kiwi's will inherit the earth. A scary episode of the twilight zone is upon us :lol:
Hansa village clubhouse . Tel 0981657001 https://www.google.co.th/maps/place/Han ... 5851?hl=en

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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by GT93 » August 4, 2020, 1:43 am

I have more pressing problems than the end of the world. I hope Premier Andrews hasn't stopped the chap who is going to make my new glasses from going to work. I'm a terribly important person Mr. Andrews.
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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by bluejets » August 4, 2020, 5:24 am

Glasses....I wish. :D :D
Been waiting for a new denture for over 9 months now.
Can hardly imagine how the virus would affect that but there ya go.

As a side note, original in Aus took 3 months, so while waiting, took a trip to Thailand and had current set done in a week, and at 80% less cost......... mmmm...sort of tells you something
As it turned out the replacement set from Aus broke in 1 week whereas the Thai build version is still going strong 3 years later.
Only reason for replacement is had a couple of teeth out and it has changed the form so glue every day now.

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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by Whistler » August 4, 2020, 8:12 am

GT93 wrote:
August 4, 2020, 1:43 am
I have more pressing problems than the end of the world. I hope Premier Andrews hasn't stopped the chap who is going to make my new glasses from going to work. I'm a terribly important person Mr. Andrews.
Mr Andrews may not be premier for that long. A big push from within Victoria Labor to force him to step down.
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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by tamada » August 4, 2020, 9:46 am

Whistler wrote:
August 4, 2020, 8:12 am
GT93 wrote:
August 4, 2020, 1:43 am
I have more pressing problems than the end of the world. I hope Premier Andrews hasn't stopped the chap who is going to make my new glasses from going to work. I'm a terribly important person Mr. Andrews.
Mr Andrews may not be premier for that long. A big push from within Victoria Labor to force him to step down.
On the grounds that single-handedly he has grossly mismanaged Victoria's pandemic response? Or is it more about his letter to the ALP national executive stating he had "no confidence" in the integrity of voting rolls used for "any internal elections in the Victorian branch" and the need for "profound reform"? Trade Union pressure?

He wasn't too popular when they won the election in happier, pre-Covid times so is there anyone in the party game enough to stick their head above the parapet on this one? Especially with this branch-stacking scandal rumbling on?

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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by Whistler » August 4, 2020, 10:23 am

Tam,

All of the above, but also from the ethnic Macadonians who are on right wing of the party. Melbourne has a huge Greek community, a significant number have issues with the extent of the shutdown. They have a petition on Change.org to force Andrew's to resign.

The trade unions seem to be behind him based on his past history of backing the powerful UFO and their disgraceful attempt to take over the CFA
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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by GT93 » August 4, 2020, 12:37 pm

Victoria's late shut down places the rest of Oz in great peril. I'd guess the chap from marketing isn't too happy. He might cop some blow-back too if things turn pear shaped in other states?

I'm surprised how late the lock down is and I suspect it needs further tightening. The later the lock down the longer it needs to be in place.

I'm not too concerned about Andrews. I hope they can make glasses in other cities in Oz. :roll:
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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by mech_401 » August 4, 2020, 2:29 pm

oh dear , will the boorish ambulance-chasers soon be making graphs and death charts for OZ
as well? talk about "embarrassed to be a briton"

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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by tamada » August 4, 2020, 10:03 pm

Whistler wrote:
August 4, 2020, 10:23 am
Tam,

All of the above, but also from the ethnic Macadonians who are on right wing of the party. Melbourne has a huge Greek community, a significant number have issues with the extent of the shutdown. They have a petition on Change.org to force Andrew's to resign.

The trade unions seem to be behind him based on his past history of backing the powerful UFO and their disgraceful attempt to take over the CFA
Thanks. I hadn't picked up on the influential Greek demographic. I did read in the UK press that more than one union weren't too happy with him calling the ALP for help or dobbing in the Vic branch, however you want to call it.

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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by GT93 » August 5, 2020, 1:50 am

mech_401 wrote:
August 4, 2020, 2:29 pm
oh dear , will the boorish ambulance-chasers soon be making graphs and death charts for OZ
as well? talk about "embarrassed to be a briton"
Eh? It's helpful for members of the public to understand the risks they're facing and to evaluate how their governments might be performing.
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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by bluejets » August 5, 2020, 6:36 am

GT93 wrote:
August 5, 2020, 1:50 am
mech_401 wrote:
August 4, 2020, 2:29 pm
oh dear , will the boorish ambulance-chasers soon be making graphs and death charts for OZ
as well? talk about "embarrassed to be a briton"
Eh? It's helpful for members of the public to understand the risks they're facing and to evaluate how their governments might be performing.
Yes, agree.
Just received tax return assessment with details of where every cent goes.
Definite advantage in being educated by the facts I'd say.

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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by Whistler » August 5, 2020, 9:49 am

tamada wrote:
August 4, 2020, 10:03 pm
Whistler wrote:
August 4, 2020, 10:23 am
Tam,

All of the above, but also from the ethnic Macadonians who are on right wing of the party. Melbourne has a huge Greek community, a significant number have issues with the extent of the shutdown. They have a petition on Change.org to force Andrew's to resign.

The trade unions seem to be behind him based on his past history of backing the powerful UFO and their disgraceful attempt to take over the CFA
Thanks. I hadn't picked up on the influential Greek demographic. I did read in the UK press that more than one union weren't too happy with him calling the ALP for help or dobbing in the Vic branch, however you want to call it.
At one point, Melbourne had the second highest population of Greeks in the world, only Athens had more.

Unions in Australia are split over factional lines, in Victoria they are predominantly on the left. In NSW they predominantly support the Right Wing. Makes for uneasy bedfellows when choosing a Labor leader. Bill Shorton was always ---- scared of the NSW Right, he consistently caved in to the faction that wrecked the last election with dud candidates from the right being mandated by the now disgraced Kaila Murnain. This led to many (including myself) to leave the party. The right is now wounded in NSW due to the Chinese donations scandal, still holds power from its weakened state.

As for Victoria, the Labor party is in an even bigger mess due to the outrageous branch stacking.

I cannot see Labor holding Victoria or winning in Oz for a long time.
I had a bumper sticker in Texas that read 'Beam me up Scotty'. I often wish I could find one in Udon Thani

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Re: A little ray of sunshine from Australia

Post by GT93 » August 6, 2020, 1:21 pm

Labour looks like it will win easily in NZ in mid-September unless we go down Victoria's path before the election. Victoria has got NZ a bit worried. It doesn't take much to go wrong before there's a catastrophic problem.

Cindy did well keeping the coalition government going full term. Some of her partners aren't the easiest of politicians.
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