Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by noosard » April 17, 2020, 3:04 pm

China has 1290 spike in deaths
Not really just adjusted some numbers

Learning to count



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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by Drunk Monkey » April 17, 2020, 3:04 pm

Today updated numbers on the link below

https://covid19.ddc.moph.go.th/en

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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by pipoz4444 » April 17, 2020, 4:04 pm

I think the Countries need to categorize and or define the types of "Testing", they are actually performing.

Some are obviously what are considered to be "Real" tests and others may simply be taking ones Temperature, which is hardly a test in the sense. Assuming there are a number of different testing procedures/protocols being used at present. :-k :-k

Single all up numbers/figures, don't always convey the truth or reality of the situation

This might give you a brief insight

https://www.medicaldevice-network.com/f ... r-antigen/

Just mt 2 Cents Worth

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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by sometimewoodworker » April 17, 2020, 9:00 pm

tamada wrote:
April 17, 2020, 2:32 pm

If Emirates (the airline) has a 10 minute, non-laboratory, Covid-19 blood test that's good enough to get you a seat on their airplanes, why isn't it sharing this magnificent, great leap forward in virus testing technology with the rest of the free world?
And you know that they are not, how?

FWIW the USA was offered tests by Germany and at least 1 other country but refused them.

It is not clear that there is any significant difference between Emirates (the airline and the UAE nor is it at all clear if it’s the airline or country that is doing the tests as the only reports of tests are from Dubai

That it’s the UAE is not surprising as the have tested 77,550 per million, for perspective the USA is 10,262 per million

A point that you may have missed is that to successfully use that test you must have the laboratories setup to process the test something that may not be simple.
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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by Whistler » April 17, 2020, 9:47 pm

sometimewoodworker wrote:
April 17, 2020, 9:00 pm
tamada wrote:
April 17, 2020, 2:32 pm

If Emirates (the airline) has a 10 minute, non-laboratory, Covid-19 blood test that's good enough to get you a seat on their airplanes, why isn't it sharing this magnificent, great leap forward in virus testing technology with the rest of the free world?
And you know that they are not, how?

FWIW the USA was offered tests by Germany and at least 1 other country but refused them.

It is not clear that there is any significant difference between Emirates (the airline and the UAE nor is it at all clear if it’s the airline or country that is doing the tests as the only reports of tests are from Dubai

That it’s the UAE is not surprising as the have tested 77,550 per million, for perspective the USA is 10,262 per million

A point that you may have missed is that to successfully use that test you must have the laboratories setup to process the test something that may not be simple.
If it is a 10 minute reliable test, there is no laboratory involved, it has to be an on situ process
lies are already halfway around the world before the truth has laced up its shoes

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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by sometimewoodworker » April 17, 2020, 10:26 pm

Whistler wrote:
April 17, 2020, 9:47 pm
sometimewoodworker wrote:
April 17, 2020, 9:00 pm
tamada wrote:
April 17, 2020, 2:32 pm

If Emirates (the airline) has a 10 minute, non-laboratory, Covid-19 blood test that's good enough to get you a seat on their airplanes, why isn't it sharing this magnificent, great leap forward in virus testing technology with the rest of the free world?
And you know that they are not, how?

FWIW the USA was offered tests by Germany and at least 1 other country but refused them.

It is not clear that there is any significant difference between Emirates (the airline and the UAE nor is it at all clear if it’s the airline or country that is doing the tests as the only reports of tests are from Dubai

That it’s the UAE is not surprising as the have tested 77,550 per million, for perspective the USA is 10,262 per million

A point that you may have missed is that to successfully use that test you must have the laboratories setup to process the test something that may not be simple.
If it is a 10 minute reliable test, there is no laboratory involved, it has to be an on situ process
And you are sure that Dubai International airport does not have a laboratory that is able to process tests? The UAE is hardly short of money and expertise and could easily have built, if needed, that facility.

It is far more likely that there is a laboratory constructed at the airport than that they have somehow managed to leapfrog everyone else and developed a test that needs no laboratory.

However it is pure speculation until there is more information available about how they are processing tests that quickly and what the test entails.

My point is that it’s rather unhelpful to castigate a country for not doing something they may well be doing along with assuming they have developed something they may well have not.

Don’t copy the Orange, facts first
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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by tamada » April 17, 2020, 11:36 pm

sometimewoodworker wrote:
April 17, 2020, 10:26 pm
Whistler wrote:
April 17, 2020, 9:47 pm
sometimewoodworker wrote:
April 17, 2020, 9:00 pm
tamada wrote:
April 17, 2020, 2:32 pm

If Emirates (the airline) has a 10 minute, non-laboratory, Covid-19 blood test that's good enough to get you a seat on their airplanes, why isn't it sharing this magnificent, great leap forward in virus testing technology with the rest of the free world?
And you know that they are not, how?

FWIW the USA was offered tests by Germany and at least 1 other country but refused them.

It is not clear that there is any significant difference between Emirates (the airline and the UAE nor is it at all clear if it’s the airline or country that is doing the tests as the only reports of tests are from Dubai

That it’s the UAE is not surprising as the have tested 77,550 per million, for perspective the USA is 10,262 per million

A point that you may have missed is that to successfully use that test you must have the laboratories setup to process the test something that may not be simple.
If it is a 10 minute reliable test, there is no laboratory involved, it has to be an on situ process
And you are sure that Dubai International airport does not have a laboratory that is able to process tests? The UAE is hardly short of money and expertise and could easily have built, if needed, that facility.

It is far more likely that there is a laboratory constructed at the airport than that they have somehow managed to leapfrog everyone else and developed a test that needs no laboratory.

However it is pure speculation until there is more information available about how they are processing tests that quickly and what the test entails.

My point is that it’s rather unhelpful to castigate a country for not doing something they may well be doing along with assuming they have developed something they may well have not.

Don’t copy the Orange, facts first
No labs at the airport required. The only ten-minute, lab-free tests are the IgM/IgG antibody tests that haven't been able to match the accuracy and reliability standards that most governments require. Apparently there's over 70 manufacturers promising the world and I would wager most of them are from China. Spain and Nepal sent test kits back to China while Malaysia and Czech Republic questioned their accuracy. As reported almost 3 weeks ago, "China's National Medicine Products Administration has granted "emergency approval" for 23 companies as of Friday, up from just four in January, to sell diagnostic kits."

https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Coron ... n-overseas

Test accuracy is unclear

But at the moment, the true accuracy of serologic tests for SARS-CoV-2 is another unknown. So far, the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has granted an emergency use authorization (EUA) for only one antibody test—the qSARS-CoV-2 IgG/IgM Rapid Test from Cellex. The EUA allows a company to market unapproved diagnostic and therapeutic products during a declared emergency. According to Cellex, the test was 93.8% sensitive in testing on 128 samples from Chinese COVID-19 patients confirmed by reverse transcription polymerase chain reaction (RT-PCR), and 96.4% specific.

Those impressive-looking numbers, though still leave the possibility of a significant number of people having false-positive and false-negative tests. For example, if 5% of the US population actually had the virus, a test with 95% sensitivity and 95% specificity conducted in a million people would correctly detect 47,500 cases, along with 2,500 false-negatives (those who were infected but were missed).

But it would also produce 47,500 false-positives. So, if only 5% of the population was infected, the number of true-positives and false-positives would be the same.

"Imagine going to a healthcare worker and saying 'we're going to test you for antibodies right now, and if you're positive, you have a 1 in 2 chance it's not real,'" says Michael Osterholm, PhD, MPH, director of the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy (publisher of CIDRAP News). "Are you actually going to use that test in a meaningful way?"


If Emirates (the airline) use it, does a +ve mean your grounded and a -ve allows you to fly? Or...

Widespread testing needed

Some countries, like Germany and the United Kingdom, have even floated the idea of "immunity passports" that could be issued to people based on results of antibody tests. While that might seem like science fiction, Gregory Storch, MD, an infectious disease specialist at Washington University School of Medicine in St. Louis says we're entering into a new world.

"You could imagine this being applied essentially to everybody who might need to be in the workforce, or might need to go to school, and people who are positive could go forth and do critical jobs that involve exposure, and they would be at no risk, or much reduced risk, compared to people who are negative," he says. "And then the people who are negative could be held back and protected as appropriate."

https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspec ... omplicated

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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by tamada » April 17, 2020, 11:41 pm

sometimewoodworker wrote:
April 17, 2020, 10:26 pm
...

FWIW the USA was offered tests by Germany and at least 1 other country but refused them.

...

Don’t copy the Orange, facts first
The United States "refused" COVID-19 diagnostic tests offered by the World Health Organization.

What's True
The U.S. did not use COVID-19 diagnostic tests produced by the World Health Organization (WHO) in favor of producing its own.

What's False
The U.S. did not turn down an offer to use those tests (as no such offer was extended), nor was it unusual for the United States to design and produce its own diagnostic tests in lieu of those made elsewhere.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/us-coronavirus-test/

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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by tamada » April 18, 2020, 12:30 am

Here's the updated list of 'selected rapid tests for SARS-Cov-2' (as of 14 April)

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41587-020-00010-2

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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by sometimewoodworker » April 18, 2020, 6:34 am

tamada wrote:
April 17, 2020, 11:41 pm
sometimewoodworker wrote:
April 17, 2020, 10:26 pm
...

FWIW the USA was offered tests by Germany and at least 1 other country but refused them.

...

Don’t copy the Orange, facts first
The United States "refused" COVID-19 diagnostic tests offered by the World Health Organization.

What's True
The U.S. did not use COVID-19 diagnostic tests produced by the World Health Organization (WHO) in favor of producing its own.

What's False
The U.S. did not turn down an offer to use those tests (as no such offer was extended), nor was it unusual for the United States to design and produce its own diagnostic tests in lieu of those made elsewhere.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/us-coronavirus-test/
The last time I looked the WHO was neither Germany nor a country :-" :-"

Your own link confirms that there was/is a test created in Germany, in Berlin. That was being distributed around the world that the USA was certainly offered and decided not to use but to go ahead with the CDC test that the first kits had to be withdrawn because the did not work.

Just because the US has always done something does not make it the best thing to do, for example Detroit.
No labs at the airport required. The only ten-minute, lab-free tests are the IgM/IgG antibody tests
There could well be a lab in the medical Center that is certainly in that airport.
The tests you are talking about determine if you have had COVID-19, not if you are currently developing it.

As I said not enough information to draw conclusions or make accusations.
The conclusions and accusations could be correct but we don’t know yet.
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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by vincemunday » April 18, 2020, 8:07 am

Maybe a vaccination is on it's way in the UK, I like to see "confidence" in a press release.

http://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-u ... y-11974920
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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by sometimewoodworker » April 18, 2020, 8:18 am

vincemunday wrote:
April 18, 2020, 8:07 am
Maybe a vaccination is on it's way in the UK, I like to see "confidence" in a press release.

http://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-u ... y-11974920
That is exactly the information I was referencing
So in September, if everything works perfectly first time (it often does not) 1.5% of the population may be able to be vaccinated.

So only health service plus a very few others

So still over 12 months for reasonably general availability
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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by Drunk Monkey » April 18, 2020, 8:22 am

PMs team Thailand to save the Nation ???

Some interesting comments and info on what restrictions may be eased and how ..

https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/ge ... ave-nation

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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by Drunk Monkey » April 18, 2020, 8:25 am

PMs Team Thailand to save the nation ..

Some interesting comments and ideas , also later in the article info on possible easing of certain restrictions

https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/ge ... ave-nation

DM
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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by vincemunday » April 18, 2020, 8:36 am

sometimewoodworker wrote:
April 18, 2020, 8:18 am
vincemunday wrote:
April 18, 2020, 8:07 am
Maybe a vaccination is on it's way in the UK, I like to see "confidence" in a press release.

http://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-u ... y-11974920
That is exactly the information I was referencing
So in September, if everything works perfectly first time (it often does not) 1.5% of the population may be able to be vaccinated.

So only health service plus a very few others

So still over 12 months for reasonably general availability
It might be quicker, they are looking for more manufacturing partners.
The forest was shrinking daily but the trees kept voting for the axe as its handle was made of wood and they thought it was one of them.

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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by sometimewoodworker » April 18, 2020, 8:42 am

vincemunday wrote:
April 18, 2020, 8:36 am
sometimewoodworker wrote:
April 18, 2020, 8:18 am
vincemunday wrote:
April 18, 2020, 8:07 am
Maybe a vaccination is on it's way in the UK, I like to see "confidence" in a press release.

http://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-u ... y-11974920
That is exactly the information I was referencing
So in September, if everything works perfectly first time (it often does not) 1.5% of the population may be able to be vaccinated.

So only health service plus a very few others

So still over 12 months for reasonably general availability
It might be quicker, they are looking for more manufacturing partners.
We are all hoping for that but should be realistic about the situation.

Next year is the earliest date that vacation will start to roll out in Thailand in any quantities unless you have the money or connections to jump the queue, there are millions of people worldwide who will be doing exactly that.
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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by tamada » April 18, 2020, 8:55 am


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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by vincemunday » April 18, 2020, 9:02 am

sometimewoodworker wrote:
April 18, 2020, 8:42 am
vincemunday wrote:
April 18, 2020, 8:36 am
sometimewoodworker wrote:
April 18, 2020, 8:18 am
vincemunday wrote:
April 18, 2020, 8:07 am
Maybe a vaccination is on it's way in the UK, I like to see "confidence" in a press release.

http://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-u ... y-11974920
That is exactly the information I was referencing
So in September, if everything works perfectly first time (it often does not) 1.5% of the population may be able to be vaccinated.

So only health service plus a very few others

So still over 12 months for reasonably general availability
It might be quicker, they are looking for more manufacturing partners.
We are all hoping for that but should be realistic about the situation.

Next year is the earliest date that vacation will start to roll out in Thailand in any quantities unless you have the money or connections to jump the queue, there are millions of people worldwide who will be doing exactly that.
I shouldn't think Thailand will come top of the important list, it does say UK. and they will quite rightly vaccinate people in the UK first. On the upside, it once again depends on finding partners to manufacture, if GSK, Pfizer etc come on board a world roll out would be way before 12 months.
The forest was shrinking daily but the trees kept voting for the axe as its handle was made of wood and they thought it was one of them.

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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by tamada » April 18, 2020, 9:31 am

sometimewoodworker wrote:
April 18, 2020, 6:34 am
tamada wrote:
April 17, 2020, 11:41 pm
sometimewoodworker wrote:
April 17, 2020, 10:26 pm
...

FWIW the USA was offered tests by Germany and at least 1 other country but refused them.

...

Don’t copy the Orange, facts first
The United States "refused" COVID-19 diagnostic tests offered by the World Health Organization.

What's True
The U.S. did not use COVID-19 diagnostic tests produced by the World Health Organization (WHO) in favor of producing its own.

What's False
The U.S. did not turn down an offer to use those tests (as no such offer was extended), nor was it unusual for the United States to design and produce its own diagnostic tests in lieu of those made elsewhere.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/us-coronavirus-test/
The last time I looked the WHO was neither Germany nor a country :-" :-"

Your own link confirms that there was/is a test created in Germany, in Berlin. That was being distributed around the world that the USA was certainly offered and decided not to use but to go ahead with the CDC test that the first kits had to be withdrawn because the did not work.

Just because the US has always done something does not make it the best thing to do, for example Detroit.
No labs at the airport required. The only ten-minute, lab-free tests are the IgM/IgG antibody tests
There could well be a lab in the medical Center that is certainly in that airport.
The tests you are talking about determine if you have had COVID-19, not if you are currently developing it.

As I said not enough information to draw conclusions or make accusations.
The conclusions and accusations could be correct but we don’t know yet.
The German test kit was one and the same as the test kit that matched the WHO"s protocol on test kits and thus the same test kit that was neither offered or declined.

You can introduce the irrelevancy of American politics into this narrative as much as you like. I still call the Emirates (the airline) plan for passenger testing for what it is, pure commercial gain that gets precariously close to sewing false hope. There's not an altruistic bone in any of their bodies.

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Re: Miscellaneous COVID-19/Corona Virus Discussion, Questions, etc.

Post by cjd01 » April 18, 2020, 9:48 am

What has the fact that an airline any airline is conducting tests on passengers before they'll let them fly, got to do with giving anybody false hope?
hope about what?

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