The Politician's New Clothes

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BigRick808
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The Politician's New Clothes

Post by BigRick808 » April 9, 2016, 3:05 am

I just love it. Long overdue! http://www.bustle.com/articles/142808-t ... california

“NASCAR for politicians.” That’s the most common analogy San Diego resident and businessman John Cox is using to describe his ballot initiative, "California Is Not For Sale," which, if it collects enough signatures, will be put before Californians in November. The proposal is relatively simple: Make California politicians wear the labels of their top ten campaign sponsors on their suits whenever they’re on the Assembly floor.

Picture it. Are you a California senator or assembly member? Did a big oil company donate a few million to your campaign? Next time you get up and give a speech in the California Assembly about

http://www.bustle.com/articles/142808-t ... california



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Lone Star
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The Politician's New Clothes

Post by Lone Star » April 9, 2016, 2:09 pm

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BigRick808
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The Politician's New Clothes

Post by BigRick808 » April 10, 2016, 12:25 am

I and others prefer to have this too. Hopefully enough people support it.

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The Politician's New Clothes

Post by BigRick808 » April 10, 2016, 12:44 am

I would like to look up some people. Do you have a link to these reports? Can you enter the politicians name and find out who their major donors are, or must you know the donor's name to find out who the politician is? I've watched C-SPAN and had no idea who all the major donors were for politicians. I'm certain I'm not the only one.

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Post by Lone Star » April 10, 2016, 9:26 am

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Jello
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Post by Jello » April 10, 2016, 9:56 am

Disclosures good but why not block corporations from buying politicians. The current system makes it very difficult someone to run for office that isn't taking these bribes.
Six years ago, as a result of the disastrous Citizens United Supreme Court decision, by a 5-to-4 vote, the U.S. Supreme Court essentially said to the wealthiest people in this country: you already own much of the American economy. Now, we are going to give you the opportunity to purchase the U.S. Government, the White House, the U.S. Senate, the U.S. House, Governors’ seats, legislatures, and State judicial branches as well.

The Citizens United decision hinges on the absurd notion that money is speech, corporations are people, and giving huge piles of undisclosed cash to politicians in exchange for access and influence does not constitute corruption.

During this campaign cycle, billions of dollars from the wealthiest people in this country are already flooding the political process. Super PACs – a direct outgrowth of the Citizens United decision – are enabling the wealthiest people and the largest corporations in this country to contribute unlimited amounts of money to campaigns.

The situation has become so absurd that super PACs, which theoretically operate independently of the actual candidates, have more money and more influence over campaigns than the candidates themselves.

We know, for example, that the Koch brothers, the second wealthiest family in America, have made public that they and their network intend to spend at least $750 million on politics during this election. This is more money than either the Democratic Party or the Republican Party will spend.

Let’s be honest and acknowledge what we are talking about. We are talking about a rapid movement in this country toward a political system in which a handful of very wealthy people and special interests will determine who gets elected or who does not get elected. That is not what this country is supposed to be about.
https://berniesanders.com/issues/money-in-politics/
Here's a group that's taking some action.
We must reverse Citizens United, Restore our Democracy, and Save the Republic. Join the Fight for Free and Fair Elections in America!
http://www.wolf-pac.com/

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Lone Star
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The Politician's New Clothes

Post by Lone Star » April 10, 2016, 10:18 am

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Post by Udon Map » April 10, 2016, 12:18 pm

Lone Star wrote:The problem isn't the corporations funding campaigns. The problem is politicians without integrity. Elect people of integrity, and they will reject cronyism and bribery.
This. Exactly.

BigRick808
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Post by BigRick808 » April 11, 2016, 2:07 am

Lone Star wrote:
BigRick808 wrote:I would like to look up some people. Do you have a link to these reports? Can you enter the politicians name and find out who their major donors are, or must you know the donor's name to find out who the politician is? I've watched C-SPAN and had no idea who all the major donors were for politicians. I'm certain I'm not the only one.
https://www.google.co.th/webhp?sourceid ... %20reports

Google is a wonderful thing. :D

For politicians in specific states, check with those states and their reporting venues.
Thanks. I've been aware of the FEC website for a while. I've never seen a consolidated site for all states. That would be good. I live about half and hour from two states and a little over an hour from another and occasionally take interest in an issue and have looked on their websites and found that they vary widely in how easy it is to find the info and how often the info is updated. I feel just as many, or maybe more, of the issues that impact my life are on the state and local level. On the county level, of the few I've viewed, I couldn't find anything. I suppose one would be able to go to the courthouse to find out. I wish more people would take an interest in local and state issues. Too many people think simply voting for the president every four years along with whatever senator or representative is running at that time is enough.

Here's an additional source of info: http://www.opensecrets.org/

BigRick808
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Post by BigRick808 » April 11, 2016, 2:20 am

Here, Ms. McMahon talks about loopholes withing the FEC regulations. http://natsummit.org/video/janet_mcmahon.htm

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Jello
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Post by Jello » April 11, 2016, 9:47 am

Lone Star wrote:Most corporations lawfully represent people and jobs. They have a right to act in their best interest and support candidates who will not harm free enterprise and individual liberty.
I disagree. A corporation is not a person and should not hold the same rights as a individual. It has no loyalty to a specific country or people. Its primary function is generate increasing profits.

The public has the right to hear all available information, and when corporations spend money individuals can’t match, messages from corporations drown out messages from others, and that information fails to reach the public.

Excluding corporations from the political process was a founding principle of the United States:
When American colonists declared independence from England in 1776, they also freed themselves from control by English corporations that extracted their wealth and dominated trade. After fighting a revolution to end this exploitation, our country’s founders retained a healthy fear of corporate power and wisely limited corporations exclusively to a business role. Corporations were forbidden from attempting to influence elections, public policy, and other realms of civic society. http://reclaimdemocracy.org/corporate-a ... ations-us/
"We the people," not we the corporations.
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Jello
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Post by Jello » April 11, 2016, 10:34 am

Lone Star wrote:There are also laws that restrict the amount of money that can be donated
But different rules apply to non-party, outside groups called political action committees, known as PACs. If a PAC contributes directly to candidates, the most a person can donate to the PAC is $5,000.[6] Significantly, if a PAC declares that it will spend its money totally independently from a candidate’s campaign, then there are no limits on donations to the PAC. These groups, which can receive unlimited contributions from individuals, corporations, or unions, are commonly called “Super PACs.”
https://www.brennancenter.org/analysis/ ... ens-united

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Post by Udon Map » April 11, 2016, 11:26 am

Jello wrote:
Lone Star wrote:Most corporations lawfully represent people and jobs. They have a right to act in their best interest and support candidates who will not harm free enterprise and individual liberty.
I disagree. A corporation is not a person and should not hold the same rights as a individual. It has no loyalty to a specific country or people. Its primary function is generate increasing profits.
Well, now, just a minute. In the U.S., a corporation is a person. Corporations can own property, sue and be sued. Subject to some limitations, they have freedom of speech, too. For example, say you have a business which you own completely. You decide to incorporate. The law does not view you, Jello, to be the same entity as Jello, Inc. Your business may do something for which it is sued, but that does not automatically mean that you can be sued individually for the same thing. And if Jello, Inc. loses the lawsuit, they can only go after Jello, Inc.'s assets to satisfy the judgment, not your house (except in certain circumstances, such as if they can prove that the corporation is a sham intended only to shield your assets from such lawsuits or defraud creditors).

Jello wrote:The public has the right to hear all available information, and when corporations spend money individuals can’t match, messages from corporations drown out messages from others, and that information fails to reach the public.
This is key, important in a democracy, and bears repeating. The public has the right to hear all available information.... As a voting member of the public, aren't I allowed to consider information from a corporation before I vote? Take global warming. Maybe a corporation is downplaying the effect of global warming and wants to provide information to try to convince people that it isn't happening. Don't I have the right to consider that information before I make my decision on how to vote on any relevant issues?

And if your threshold criterion is ...when corporations spend money individuals can’t match..., what about individuals who can match that level of expenditure? Should they, too, be prohibited from the process? And if the criterion is that corporations cannot contribute but individuals can, does that mean that the drug store I own (a corporation) cannot contribute to a political campaign, but Bill Gates can because he's an individual not a corporation?

I see a slippery slope problem (among others) here.

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Post by Lone Star » April 11, 2016, 2:55 pm

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Post by Lone Star » April 11, 2016, 3:10 pm

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Post by BigRick808 » April 11, 2016, 11:15 pm

:D Makes a man want a drink ;) Let's lighten things up for a few minutes with some music..........

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--AvCsh48bk

Keeping up with all of this is a part time job, at least.

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Post by glalt » April 12, 2016, 9:44 am

I heard that the republicans tried to give Kalifornia to Mexico. The Mexicans were not stupid enough to take it. The Land of Fruits and Nuts is still part of the USA.

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Post by Jello » April 12, 2016, 10:30 am

Remember when that little corporation next door finally learned how to ride a bike?
Neither do I.

Image

Corporations are not people. Elections should not be auctions.

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Post by Lone Star » April 12, 2016, 6:08 pm

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Post by tutone » April 12, 2016, 6:25 pm

BigRick808 wrote:I would like to look up some people. Do you have a link to these reports? Can you enter the politicians name and find out who their major donors are, or must you know the donor's name to find out who the politician is? I've watched C-SPAN and had no idea who all the major donors were for politicians. I'm certain I'm not the only one.
Try this. https://www.opensecrets.org/

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