European solidarity or not?

Post by **waanjai** » September 14, 2015, 2:47 am

It was expected, that Germany would bring the topic of solidarity back onto the Agenda. They did it on Sunday local time.

"BRUSSELS - The EU said Germany's reinstatement of temporary border controls on Sunday "underlines the urgency" of the need for European Union member states to share the burden of accepting tens of thousands of refugees.
German Chancellor Angela Merkel informed European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker of the decision, under rules governing Europe's borderless Schengen area, according to a statement from the commission, the executive of the 28-nation EU.
"The German decision of today underlines the urgency to agree on the measures proposed by the European Commission in order to manage the refugee crisis," it said......"

http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/world/6 ... r-controls

Bad times for the Brits and all the others.

Post by **parrot** » September 14, 2015, 3:25 am

Although not from the EU, I'm very interested in following the news there. Probably my 110v-wired brain that compares the mechanics of the EU to the US. So, when I read stories like the one above...and many others concerning the current situation in the EU regarding the influx of refugees......I can't help but wonder how countries like the UK or Italy or Spain might feel about German Chancellor Merkel when she seems to speak for the EU.
Me personally, I prefer the US way.....when I think of Bill Clinton, I don't think of a particular state (he was from Arkansas) or Obama (from Chicago) or Bush (from Texas). I realize I have lots to learn about the EU model......so I'll continue reading

Post by **parrot** » September 14, 2015, 4:00 am

While I found the article at http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/13/opini ... ocide.html enlightening, the one sentence that stook out above all:

"Many of these populist parties are supported by Russia, which is openly pursuing a divide-and-conquer policy with the aim of bringing about European disintegration."

And I thought the cold war was over.

Post by **waanjai** » September 14, 2015, 5:20 am

parrot wrote:"Many of these populist parties are supported by Russia, which is openly pursuing a divide-and-conquer policy with the aim of bringing about European disintegration."

And all these bombings of the Middle East were intended as a kind invitation to the people that wanted to flee this terror to happily embark the next ship to the land of the free?

As a matter of fact there are now millions of people driven to leave this region. Certain other regions - far away enough from this region - tend to like to just watch and see - splendid isolation. Europe - that rejects to become unified by an US-style civil war - has to act as nobody knows of an acceptable way of stopping the movements now.

In a time that needs action, a time in which refugees need urgent help, philosophical and historical deliberations are simply that what they want to disguise - expressions of the unwillingness to help real people in real need.

Post by **tigerryan** » September 14, 2015, 7:06 am

I can't get my head around "refugee" in this context. When I think of refugees I think of little kids with a fly in their eye with a distended stomach or old people being carried on a donkey with parents holding all of their worldly possessions wrapped up in a rug. The videos and pictures I have seen are almost all young men straight out of a disco in Damascus. A news photographer would likely try to capture the children or the old folks for effect there just doesn't seem to be any. Why in the hell would any country be offering asylum to these young men who are abandoning families and county when they are clearly needed at home?

Post by **pomps** » September 14, 2015, 7:58 am

Not seen any update in the news from Germany whether they will accept Saudis help with money from them to build up to 200 mosques to help with the refugee problem,only as mentioned border controls being reintroduced.
No doubt help should be forthcoming for all European countries,wait for update on the emergency meetings in Europe later today

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/saudi-arabia-p ... ny-1519298

Post by **FrazeeDK** » September 14, 2015, 8:14 am

refugees, economic migrants, or just folks looking for something better. The little kid who drowned? He was born in Turkey in a refugee camp and his family decided to leave that camp and go to Europe... As the news shows various European countries saying they will accept 500,000, 800,000 or however many people for relocation it is a "draw", a massive magnet for any people in the Middle East and sub-Saharan Africa looking for a better life. The Europeans had best put some serious controls at the borders or the flood will continue.. I saw an interview on BBC the other day with some Iraqi middle class folks who'd decided to just buy airline tickets and fly to Europe for a better life..

I see the media and some groups trying to shame nations within Europe for "not doing their fair share" of accepting more refugees.. The U.S. gets lambasted so, "oh, we'll take 10,000"... To me its all avoiding the primary issue which is instability, bad governance, unemployment, and a crappy life in the majority of the countries these "refugees" are fleeing.. I really don't see the U.N. or western countries focusing on getting those countries back on their feet so the flood of emigrants will slow..

Oh, I've got to wonder if the Turks are encouraging the "refugees" they are hosting to head to Europe.. That would certainly take the heat off them since they got plenty of Syrian, Kurdish, and Iraqis living in camps in Turkey...

Post by **12345** » September 14, 2015, 9:28 am

Hey EU..............som naa na

Intelligent, and smoking hot................that's sexy.......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHFnvFbThDE

Post by **waanjai** » September 14, 2015, 12:24 pm

Does anyone know what measures were proposed by the European Commission to manage the refugee crisis?

Post by **12345** » September 14, 2015, 2:22 pm

Does anyone really want these people in your home country................real news, not "Entertainment NetWork News"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZV315xqbRK8#t=28

Post by **jackspratt** » September 14, 2015, 3:24 pm

12345 wrote:Does anyone really want these people in your home country................real news, not "Entertainment NetWork News"

Hmmm .............. "real news"?

A hotchpotch of disconnected videos, without any supporting evidence or background material, emanating seemingly from within the fetid bowels of Infowars/Prison Planet - yes, the home of Alex Jones.

Even your favoured outlet, RT, gave a more balanced view of what happened in the "terrorized family/railway tracks" segment.

https://www.rt.com/news/314296-police-r ... eo-tracks/

I'll stick with the BBC, thanks LA.

Post by **12345** » September 14, 2015, 3:31 pm

you're welcome...........yea, not a big fan or infowars/jones........but, that many people, I'm surprised they aren't have many more problems.

I like the Syrian chickie, besides being a cutie...........think she nailed it........network news / total BS.

Post by **rick** » September 14, 2015, 3:55 pm

Just 2 points to add to the debate - firstly Germany has a declining population and needs workers for their industries and to pay taxes (to support all the pensioners). Hence why some (not all) in Germany want migrants. Secondly, the UN have run out of money to feed and finance the refugees in countries neighbouring Syria and has cut off supporting those outside refugee camps completely and slashed it by 50% for those in the camps - this represents over 4 MILLION people. With no end to the war in sight, refugees from Syria have 3 options - return to Syria (and risk death) stay in the camps and starve (slow death) or go to Europe. The problem is just beginning.

Post by **ronan01** » September 14, 2015, 4:43 pm

And Germany has regained its senses - if reports are correct it is closing its borders, as is Sweden and Denmark, and Hungary.

I think somebody finally realised the open border position might encourage the other 5, 10, 15 million (pick a number) migrants / refugees to simply arrive at the border and demand to go to Germany, not a sustainable position.

I am surprised at how confident these migrants / refugees are in asserting their "right" to go to Germany / Sweden / Denmark.

Any nation that cannot control its borders is not in control and will eventually cease to be a nation.

Post by **MrFixer** » September 14, 2015, 11:38 pm

I think Merkel made a massive miscalculation in implying there was an 'open door' policy for refugees in Germany. The Germans are now expecting to receive 1,000,000+ refugees this year alone. Added to previous waves of asylum-seekers that is already 2-3 million of the population. With more likely to arrive in future years that could lead to a potential destabilisation of the country. It will certainly make life a lot tougher for low-income Germans who will face stiffer competition for low skill jobs and cheap accommodation. Support for right-wing populist parties will surely grow.
The Germans also seem to have miscalculated in expecting other EU countries to be similarly welcoming. The UK is out of Schengen and won't be taking any from the EU. The French say they'll take some, prrsumably to be warehoused in grim appartment blocks which are already full of disaffected Muslim youths of North African
decent. Not a happy future for many.
The political class who have created this mess will live lives relatively untouched by the consequences of their actions...

Post by **mancman** » September 15, 2015, 7:21 am

jackspratt wrote:
12345 wrote:Does anyone really want these people in your home country................real news, not "Entertainment NetWork News"

Hmmm .............. "real news"?

A hotchpotch of disconnected videos, without any supporting evidence or background material, emanating seemingly from within the fetid bowels of Infowars/Prison Planet - yes, the home of Alex Jones.

Even your favoured outlet, RT, gave a more balanced view of what happened in the "terrorized family/railway tracks" segment. : ( the Hubby was in a good position to get of the tracks first "if" a train came, check out the suitcase it looks like it has been dragged a 1000 miles from Syria lol

https://www.rt.com/news/314296-police-r ... eo-tracks/

I'll stick with the BBC, thanks LA.

Post by **12345** » September 15, 2015, 9:28 am

Post by **waanjai** » September 15, 2015, 5:48 pm

Last night the conference of the ministers (of Interior) of the EU member states in Brussels achieved a majority for the suggestion by the European Commission to distribute incoming accepted erfugees according to a fixed quota system based on 4 factors (population, economic strength, unemployment rate and previous efforts to protect refugees). But it has become common for the decision making processes within the EU that for "important issues" they want to achieve unanimity. Next attempt will be the October meeting.

The meeting was without the UK of course. As the UK are out of everything that matters - like the Schengen zone or the Euro zone. UK might even leave the Free Trade Zone EU next year and lose the European continental market that became bigger and bigger. With Britannia still rules the seas (Miss Marple) they might then try to monopolize mackerel fishing.

Post by **MrFixer** » September 15, 2015, 6:27 pm

Its not often that British politicians show great wisdom, but they did so when they decided to keep the UK out of the Euro and out of Schengen.
The Euro has certainly not benefitted the average working man in Europe. Prices shot up at its introduction and it has inflicted great hardship on the southern European economies. The Greek crisis has been postponed, but not solved.
As for Schengen... what kind of insanity is it allows hundreds of thousands of undocumented individuals from the most unstable parts of the globe to roam freely and without checks across 26 countries?

Post by **waanjai** » September 15, 2015, 11:08 pm

The old route to Germany, Denmark, Sweden etc.

Proposed new routes as heard from the refugees.

The deviation to Slovenia might also "open" a trail thru Northern Italy to France and its neighbors.